ouhoops.com
forums roster schedule stats rankings NET bracketology big xII standings recruiting ouhoopstv

Go Back   OUHoops > Main Category > The Wayman Tisdale Men's Hoops Board

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 01-19-2023, 10:25 AM   #1
OkieTC
Walk-on
 
OkieTC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 175
Default Potential lineup changes??

Letís face it. We will get out-athleted all season with the Grove brothers starting. We are just too slow footed with them both starting. Tanner would make a fine quality back-up center(I know, he is all we got), and isnít bad when he his hitting 3ís. Jacob has improved a lotÖbut would still be the 8th or 9th guy for upper level Big12 teams. We need more athletes on the court. Is Benny S really not ready to play at this level. He looked so athletic playing European ball? And Bam looks so much quicker than what we are rolling out. I wonder at some point if we donít start playing for the future and get these guys some minutes? I havenít seen these guys practice, I just really wonder what is holding them back? Anyone who has seen them, please feel free to comment.
OkieTC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:27 AM   #2
TINY
All-American
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,930
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

We really need Bamisile to take Jacob’s spot. Jacob could be first off the bench, instant offense. I have no idea what happened to Joe but need the light to turn on asap.
TINY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:39 AM   #3
WichitaSooner
Sweet 16
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,106
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

I don't think Benny is realistic. The time he missed in the offseason, and again a few weeks ago, makes it very hard for him to be ready to help in any way. I agree that he looked good in the two-minute runs he got against terrible teams, but it seems a stretch to think he could come in and help us against Big 12 players.

I can only assume that Bam hasn't shown any/enough signs of improvement to make Moser think his upside is worth the risk. He is the biggest disappointment of the season. He has athleticism that no one else on the team has, so if he would have worked out, it could have completely changed the dynamic of the team. I guess it's possible he could still figure things out, but it needs to happen fast.

Last night was the perfect chance to give Bam and Oweh a chance. The starters were playing like crap, we were getting blown out in the second half, the effort was lackluster ... that's the time to take a flyer and hope they can come in and spark you, and even if you lose the game, you at least give them some confidence. I still can't believe how little Moser did during the second half. Burn through your timeouts, pull every starter, light into the team ... just try something.
WichitaSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:47 AM   #4
OkieTC
Walk-on
 
OkieTC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 175
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Totally agree Wichita. I know the coaches see these guys daily, but sometimes when things aren’t working, and you obviously won’t win, it would be nice to give some of these bench guys a little run. Sometimes guys just need a shot. Maybe we might catch lightning in a bottle with one of them? Maybe not. But we will never know without trying. I know right now that Moser is losing fans. This team is just soo hard to watch. I love Sooner hoops, but games like last night are hard to stomach. Especially when there isn’t much hope for improvement. Some of these guys are maxed out athletically and just CAN’T give us anymore than they already are. I appreciate the effort, but some changes have to happen.
OkieTC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:49 AM   #5
SoonerBounce13
National Champion
 
SoonerBounce13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,455
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OkieTC View Post
Totally agree Wichita. I know the coaches see these guys daily, but sometimes when things arenít working, and you obviously wonít win, it would be nice to give some of these bench guys a little run. Sometimes guys just need a shot. Maybe we might catch lightning in a bottle with one of them? Maybe not. But we will never know without trying. I know right now that Moser is losing fans. This team is just soo hard to watch. I love Sooner hoops, but games like last night are hard to stomach. Especially when there isnít much hope for improvement. Some of these guys are maxed out athletically and just CANíT give us anymore than they already are. I appreciate the effort, but some changes have to happen.
Maybe they don't get more time because they aren't doing the things they need to do to earn more time.

I tend to trust coaches since they deal with these kids every day
__________________
"But I know some of the qualities of the coach I would pick. Somebody that doesn't mind working, a coach that's going to bring a fresh mindset and help us all get better as basketball players as well as men. A coach that has all our best interests at heart."

-Romero Osby
SoonerBounce13 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:55 AM   #6
OkieTC
Walk-on
 
OkieTC's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Wichita, KS
Posts: 175
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

I know what you are saying…but if the players not playing aren’t at least close to being as good as the Groves, them Moser failed in his recruiting evals last season.

Last edited by OkieTC; 01-19-2023 at 10:56 AM. Reason: Sp
OkieTC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 11:13 AM   #7
SoonerBounce13
National Champion
 
SoonerBounce13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,455
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OkieTC View Post
I know what you are sayingÖbut if the players not playing arenít at least close to being as good as the Groves, them Moser failed in his recruiting evals last season.
I was meaning more off the court stuff than their level of play.
Maybe they are blowing off classes. Maybe they aren't doing what they need in practice or the weight room. Maybe they haven't bought in.

There could be a number or reasons why younger players aren't playing that isn't related to talent level or capabilities on the court
__________________
"But I know some of the qualities of the coach I would pick. Somebody that doesn't mind working, a coach that's going to bring a fresh mindset and help us all get better as basketball players as well as men. A coach that has all our best interests at heart."

-Romero Osby
SoonerBounce13 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 11:23 AM   #8
thebigabd
National Champion
 
thebigabd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 13,354
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by OkieTC View Post
I know what you are sayingÖbut if the players not playing arenít at least close to being as good as the Groves, them Moser failed in his recruiting evals last season.
That's not possible... There is no way Moser missed players in his own backyard to go to Germany and get some dude who can't play. I just don't believe that is possible.
__________________
Quannas White - The Future
thebigabd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 07:18 PM   #9
Seymore Cox
National Champion
 
Seymore Cox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,689
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by SoonerBounce13 View Post
I was meaning more off the court stuff than their level of play.
Maybe they are blowing off classes. Maybe they aren't doing what they need in practice or the weight room. Maybe they haven't bought in.

There could be a number or reasons why younger players aren't playing that isn't related to talent level or capabilities on the court
Hell naw. Moser is too uptight. He doesn’t let his assistants talk in practice and he doesn’t play players he’s not comfortable with. He doesn’t do well with players making mistakes.



He should have played those guys more in the non conferences.

He’s too rigid and needs to be more flexible for his players to get better.
__________________
:hardrick

Last edited by Seymore Cox; 01-19-2023 at 07:27 PM.
Seymore Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 07:19 PM   #10
Seymore Cox
National Champion
 
Seymore Cox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,689
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by TINY View Post
We really need Bamisile to take Jacobís spot. Jacob could be first off the bench, instant offense. I have no idea what happened to Joe but need the light to turn on asap.
Bamisile is the 2023 version of Marvin Johnson. I donít think he can coach raw athletes. Thatís what Bamisile is.
__________________
:hardrick
Seymore Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 07:32 PM   #11
WichitaSooner
Sweet 16
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,106
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seymore Cox View Post
Hell naw. Moser is too uptight. He doesnít let his assistants talk in practice and he doesnít play players heís not comfortable with. He doesnít do well with players making mistakes.



He should have played those guys more in the non conferences.

Heís too rigid and needs to be more flexible for his players to get better.
Yikes is that really the case, he doesnít let his assistants speak in practice? I canít imagine being a grown man and not being able to talk at your job. If that doesnít change, I imagine the staff turnover will be an annual occurrence.
WichitaSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 08:05 PM   #12
Stikboy
All-American
 
Join Date: Oct 2009
Posts: 2,857
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seymore Cox View Post
Hell naw. Moser is too uptight. He doesnít let his assistants talk in practice and he doesnít play players heís not comfortable with. He doesnít do well with players making mistakes.



He should have played those guys more in the non conferences.

Heís too rigid and needs to be more flexible for his players to get better.
If he doesn't do well with players making mistakes, how do you explain the same guys he continues to run out there putting up astronomical turnover numbers and constantly getting in foul trouble? Moser's love affair with the Groves brothers is off the chain. I knew Tanner would start because like someone said, he's all we've got. But when Jacob was in the initial starting lineup, I was like, ok, he's starting all the experienced guys to begin the season. I was sure someone like Oweh, Bam, or Uzan(in his case he eventually did, Noland) would replace him by conference. Well, nope.

While every opponent we play continues to jump higher, blow by us, out quick us, beat us to balls, etc, Moser has hitched his wagon to the computer geeks. Sure, Tanner has rare games where he hits a couple of threes. He does rebound some when he's not in foul trouble. Jacob, all I can reason is that Moser likes the fact that he's 6-9 and thinks he can get a mismatch a few times a game offensively. But meanwhile with that size he gets next to no rebounds(did he get one rebound yesterday?), is horrible defensively and if he's not having a game like Texas where he's hitting 3s i'm not sure where is value outweighs his liabilities. But, Porter keeps going on and on about those two and how competitive they are and how much they want to win and how much they've improved blah blah blah. Did you know Tanner is 242 now? Awesome!

Porter did sign two highly rated guys, again. Kudos! Guards. I guess the plan is to trust that and hope the talent and athleticism continues to improve? But, besides Uzan, the way he's not playing freshmen he better get it going in the portal or next year could be worse. Does Moser have the ability to recruit athleticism in any player above 6-5? While the two HS guys were good recruiting coups, I couldn't believe the number of portal guys NAIA Allstar posted about in the portal thread that we struck out on. Even though he's been better than everyone thought, it's telling that a walkon is our backup big. I know Porter had the fat porn stache big at Loyola. Has he ever recruited and/or featured an athletic, physical big? We get our lunch eaten inside in every Big 12 game. Our finishing is horrible. This is OU, not Maryland Eastern Shore for crying out loud..
Stikboy is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 08:10 PM   #13
Seymore Cox
National Champion
 
Seymore Cox's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 8,689
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stikboy View Post
If he doesn't do well with players making mistakes, how do you explain the same guys he continues to run out there putting up astronomical turnover numbers and constantly getting in foul trouble? Moser's love affair with the Groves brothers is off the chain. I knew Tanner would start because like someone said, he's all we've got. But when Jacob was in the initial starting lineup, I was like, ok, he's starting all the experienced guys to begin the season. I was sure someone like Oweh, Bam, or Uzan(in his case he eventually did, Noland) would replace him by conference. Well, nope.

While every opponent we play continues to jump higher, blow by us, out quick us, beat us to balls, etc, Moser has hitched his wagon to the computer geeks. Sure, Tanner has rare games where he hits a couple of threes. He does rebound some when he's not in foul trouble. Jacob, all I can reason is that Moser likes the fact that he's 6-9 and thinks he can get a mismatch a few times a game offensively. But meanwhile with that size he gets next to no rebounds(did he get one rebound yesterday?), is horrible defensively and if he's not having a game like Texas where he's hitting 3s i'm not sure where is value outweighs his liabilities. But, Porter keeps going on and on about those two and how competitive they are and how much they want to win and how much they've improved blah blah blah. Did you know Tanner is 242 now? Awesome!

Porter did sign two highly rated guys, again. Kudos! Guards. I guess the plan is to trust that and hope the talent and athleticism continues to improve? But, besides Uzan, the way he's not playing freshmen he better get it going in the portal or next year could be worse. Does Moser have the ability to recruit athleticism in any player above 6-5? While the two HS guys were good recruiting coups, I couldn't believe the number of portal guys NAIA Allstar posted about in the portal thread that we struck out on. Even though he's been better than everyone thought, it's telling that a walkon is our backup big. I know Porter had the fat porn stache big at Loyola. Has he ever recruited and/or featured an athletic, physical big? We get our lunch eaten inside in every Big 12 game. Our finishing is horrible. This is OU, not Maryland Eastern Shore for crying out loud..
I agree
__________________
:hardrick
Seymore Cox is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 08:38 PM   #14
WichitaSooner
Sweet 16
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,106
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Stikboy View Post
If he doesn't do well with players making mistakes, how do you explain the same guys he continues to run out there putting up astronomical turnover numbers and constantly getting in foul trouble? Moser's love affair with the Groves brothers is off the chain. I knew Tanner would start because like someone said, he's all we've got. But when Jacob was in the initial starting lineup, I was like, ok, he's starting all the experienced guys to begin the season. I was sure someone like Oweh, Bam, or Uzan(in his case he eventually did, Noland) would replace him by conference. Well, nope.

While every opponent we play continues to jump higher, blow by us, out quick us, beat us to balls, etc, Moser has hitched his wagon to the computer geeks. Sure, Tanner has rare games where he hits a couple of threes. He does rebound some when he's not in foul trouble. Jacob, all I can reason is that Moser likes the fact that he's 6-9 and thinks he can get a mismatch a few times a game offensively. But meanwhile with that size he gets next to no rebounds(did he get one rebound yesterday?), is horrible defensively and if he's not having a game like Texas where he's hitting 3s i'm not sure where is value outweighs his liabilities. But, Porter keeps going on and on about those two and how competitive they are and how much they want to win and how much they've improved blah blah blah. Did you know Tanner is 242 now? Awesome!

Porter did sign two highly rated guys, again. Kudos! Guards. I guess the plan is to trust that and hope the talent and athleticism continues to improve? But, besides Uzan, the way he's not playing freshmen he better get it going in the portal or next year could be worse. Does Moser have the ability to recruit athleticism in any player above 6-5? While the two HS guys were good recruiting coups, I couldn't believe the number of portal guys NAIA Allstar posted about in the portal thread that we struck out on. Even though he's been better than everyone thought, it's telling that a walkon is our backup big. I know Porter had the fat porn stache big at Loyola. Has he ever recruited and/or featured an athletic, physical big? We get our lunch eaten inside in every Big 12 game. Our finishing is horrible. This is OU, not Maryland Eastern Shore for crying out loud..
This times a million. Itís a minor point in this post, but the loose ball point is something that drives me crazy, but as you say, itís not effort, itís the fact our opponents are longer and quicker and jump higher. Even if we have better position, we probably only come up with about 30 percent of 50/50 balls.

Tanner is just a frustrating player to watch. He does rebound well and he plays hard, but his basketball IQ isnít where youíd expect from a fifth year player. And his shooting has dropped off so much. He doesnít have a low post game, and if he canít make more than 25 percent from distance, opposing bigs donít have to worry much about him outside, so his offensive value becomes next to nothing.
WichitaSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 10:17 PM   #15
SoonerBounce13
National Champion
 
SoonerBounce13's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 11,455
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Seymore Cox View Post
Hell naw. Moser is too uptight. He doesnít let his assistants talk in practice and he doesnít play players heís not comfortable with. He doesnít do well with players making mistakes.



He should have played those guys more in the non conferences.

Heís too rigid and needs to be more flexible for his players to get better.
Based on what?
__________________
"But I know some of the qualities of the coach I would pick. Somebody that doesn't mind working, a coach that's going to bring a fresh mindset and help us all get better as basketball players as well as men. A coach that has all our best interests at heart."

-Romero Osby
SoonerBounce13 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-19-2023, 11:23 PM   #16
skyvue
National Champion
 
skyvue's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 7,651
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

We saw nothing from Bamasile that made me think he's any kind of answer, and if he'd shown any progress at all in practice, I'm sure he'd be getting minutes.
__________________
ďWhen most people say they are being 'realistic,' they delude themselves; they are simply being negative.Ē
óDr. Norman Vincent Peale
skyvue is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 08:08 AM   #17
38red
Walk-on
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 215
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by skyvue View Post
We saw nothing from Bamasile that made me think he's any kind of answer, and if he'd shown any progress at all in practice, I'm sure he'd be getting minutes.
We saw nothing from CJ that made me thing he's any kind of answer, he's just a guy. I'm concerned with Moser's ability to adapt to his players available, we won't be competing for the top half of the big12 with the Grove Bro's and CJ playing starter minutes.

In pre-season all he talked about with Bamasile was how good he was in the open court but he doesn't allow his teams to attack off rebounds consistently. I'll be concerned with keeping Uzan, Oweh & Cooper type players. Uzan because he's a stud now, the others because they will need time to fit into Moser's system. Will they have the patience for this, cause it doesn't look like Moser will have to patience to work them in.

Note: I do like Moser but it feels to rigid and it's hard to recruit athletes when you don't let them be athletes!
38red is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 08:11 AM   #18
Abe
Walk-on
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 95
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

We must be going to different practices. The ones I have been to last year and this year do not support your comments.
Abe is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 08:18 AM   #19
WichitaSooner
Sweet 16
 
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 4,106
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

I do worry about Uzan. He will have plenty of programs interested if he decides he doesnít want to stick around in a system designed around walking it up the floor and playing ugly, low scoring games.

My take on Bam and Oweh: look for opportunities to give them a few minutes in certain matchups. Wednesday was the perfect chance given how poorly the regulars played and how easily their guards were getting by us.

Fun fact: before we played KU, their backup big, Clemence, had scored two points this season. That wasnít a per game average, it was his season total. Self remembered his success against us last year and obviously felt he would give Tanner trouble since he can step out and stretch the floor. Clemence came through with 10 huge points and made a couple big threes in the first half. There will be other games where he doesnít even step on the court. Moser needs to find spots like that for our guys. If they play well, they earn more minutes. If they donít, at least youíve tried something else.
WichitaSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 08:44 AM   #20
TINY
All-American
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 2,930
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by Abe View Post
We must be going to different practices. The ones I have been to last year and this year do not support your comments.
It does fit the anti-Moser narrative, thoughÖ
TINY is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 09:16 AM   #21
61sooner
Role Player
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 550
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Perhaps Moser is closer to a small program type coach then one at a high profile school. He may be overwhelmed. coaching in the Big 12. He isn't a Kelvin type of grinder more like old timer Doyle Parrack who was a bust 60 years ago trying to be a Hank Iba disciple.
61sooner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 09:23 AM   #22
BoulderSooner
Owner/Operator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: OKlahoma City
Posts: 8,730
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by 61sooner View Post
Perhaps Moser is closer to a small program type coach then one at a high profile school. He may be overwhelmed. coaching in the Big 12. He isn't a Kelvin type of grinder more like old timer Doyle Parrack who was a bust 60 years ago trying to be a Hank Iba disciple.
he is 100% a kelvin type of grinder ..
BoulderSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 09:45 AM   #23
AdaSooner
Admin Emeritus
 
AdaSooner's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 15,982
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by BoulderSooner View Post
he is 100% a kelvin type of grinder ..
Ö.before KS spent time as an assistant in the NBA, maybe.

It would be an insult to Kelvin to compare Moser to him now!
AdaSooner is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 09:48 AM   #24
thebigabd
National Champion
 
thebigabd's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 13,354
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdaSooner View Post
Ö.before KS spent time as an assistant in the NBA, maybe.

It would be an insult to Kelvin to compare Moser to him now!
For sure.
__________________
Quannas White - The Future
thebigabd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-20-2023, 10:48 AM   #25
BoulderSooner
Owner/Operator
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: OKlahoma City
Posts: 8,730
Default Re: Potential lineup changes??

Quote:
Originally Posted by AdaSooner View Post
Ö.before KS spent time as an assistant in the NBA, maybe.

It would be an insult to Kelvin to compare Moser to him now!
i don't know about an insult .. but yeah clearly i was talking about the kelvin that was the OU coach in a much much much weaker big 12
BoulderSooner is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 11:49 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.7.3
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Hosted By: URLJet.com