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Old 07-13-2016, 01:52 AM   #26
OUballer
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

I think kruger needs to recruit some size. OU needs size too compete consistantly. Its amazing this board thinks OU is ok with no size inside to score. We need a big who can score and rebound. too help keep the defense honest.
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Old 07-13-2016, 04:02 AM   #27
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

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It sure doesn't feel like it, but if history repeats itself, yes. Lon tends to rebuild quickly, and then fade just about as quickly. Lon peaked in year 2 at KSU, year 3 at UNLV, and year 4 at Florida. Just looking at the numbers and removing my personal bias, it's hard to predict that year 5 isn't his peak at OU.

Again, I hope I'm wrong. It's just hard to come to any other conclusion looking strictly at Lon's career by the numbers. However, he has bucked a few trends here at OU. Despite all his noted improvement stories, he's never improved 5 straight years, and this last year was probably his most successful. Additionally, he's had more of a steadiness these last two stops (UNLV, OU), so it's possible.
He peaks early on because he doesn't stay long at any one place. If he leaves OU after this coming season, he will most assuredly have peaked after Year 5.

He's also bucked another trend. He never had multiple Sweet 16 trips in any one coaching stop...but he does now. I'm also certain he's never had an AD like Joe C which puts Lon in a position to consistently win.
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Old 07-13-2016, 04:39 AM   #28
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

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If Payton Pritchard is hear, doubt young would be, not scared of him just he wants the full reigns.

Ou coaches thought they had shake!!
Is Pritchard back in the mix?
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Old 07-13-2016, 06:23 AM   #29
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Is Pritchard back in the mix?
No. Sorry bad English there.

If he would've signed, I think young isn't considering us

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Old 07-13-2016, 06:53 AM   #30
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I think kruger needs to recruit some size. OU needs size too compete consistantly. Its amazing this board thinks OU is ok with no size inside to score. We need a big who can score and rebound. too help keep the defense honest.
Yeah like our big that could score inside last year when we made the final 4.
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Old 07-13-2016, 07:02 AM   #31
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Yeah like our big that could score inside last year when we made the final 4.
He meant to consistently stay on top. We don't have Buddy Hield to save us this season. That was what he meant.
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Old 07-13-2016, 08:27 AM   #32
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He meant to consistently stay on top. We don't have Buddy Hield to save us this season. That was what he meant.
Great programs don't rebuild very often. Do I expect a final four this year? No

But we'll win a lot of games and being ready in March
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Old 07-13-2016, 08:40 AM   #33
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

Some of the stuff I've read in this thread leaves me shaking my head in amazement.

So Kruger's future success (or lack of success) at OU will be determined by some "trend" he established 20-30 years ago?
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:17 AM   #34
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Some of the stuff I've read in this thread leaves me shaking my head in amazement.

So Kruger's future success (or lack of success) at OU will be determined by some "trend" he established 20-30 years ago?
Who knew???
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:41 AM   #35
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

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I think kruger needs to recruit some size. OU needs size too compete consistantly. Its amazing this board thinks OU is ok with no size inside to score. We need a big who can score and rebound. too help keep the defense honest.
I agree we need a very good big for 2017. A T Thomas type big would be OK.
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Old 07-13-2016, 03:23 PM   #36
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It sure doesn't feel like it, but if history repeats itself, yes. Lon tends to rebuild quickly, and then fade just about as quickly. Lon peaked in year 2 at KSU, year 3 at UNLV, and year 4 at Florida. Just looking at the numbers and removing my personal bias, it's hard to predict that year 5 isn't his peak at OU.



Again, I hope I'm wrong. It's just hard to come to any other conclusion looking strictly at Lon's career by the numbers. However, he has bucked a few trends here at OU. Despite all his noted improvement stories, he's never improved 5 straight years, and this last year was probably his most successful. Additionally, he's had more of a steadiness these last two stops (UNLV, OU), so it's possible.


I'm sorry but I don't think this has anything to do with the current situation for OU men's basketball. There might be more talent in the program than there's been in a long time and the level they're recruiting at is higher than many thought Coach would be capable of. I've seen signs that make me think the best might be yet to come.


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Old 07-13-2016, 04:39 PM   #37
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I'm sorry but I don't think this has anything to do with the current situation for OU men's basketball. There might be more talent in the program than there's been in a long time and the level they're recruiting at is higher than many thought Coach would be capable of. I've seen signs that make me think the best might be yet to come.


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I'm simply saying that I doubt K-State fans thought it reasonable that they would never have another 20 win season following their Elite 8 finish in his second year. I also doubt Florida expected to follow up a 29 win Final 4 season with a 29-29 record the following two years. Even UNLV saw a similar drop off after their 30 win season, though not as bad.

There's a good chance that this past season was Kruger's golden season here, and it's silly to not recognize that as a strong possibility.
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Old 07-13-2016, 05:01 PM   #38
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Default Has OU peaked under Kruger?

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I'm simply saying that I doubt K-State fans thought it reasonable that they would never have another 20 win season following their Elite 8 finish in his second year. I also doubt Florida expected to follow up a 29 win Final 4 season with a 29-29 record the following two years. Even UNLV saw a similar drop off after their 30 win season, though not as bad.



There's a good chance that this past season was Kruger's golden season here, and it's silly to not recognize that as a strong possibility.


Again, I don't think your argument translates. This is a different situation completely for Kruger. This program is superior to every program Coach has been in almost every way. His recruiting is improving and the talent level across the roster has continued to improve almost every cycle. Besides what ut is doing (almost completely unrelated) and what Coach did at inferior basketball programs in the past, what evidence directly involving OU basketball do you see foretelling the kind of drop off you are predicting (at worst a .500 record, possibly no more 20 win seasons which would also mean rare NCAA tourney trips). You make it sound like OU basketball is a plane with an engine out. I see staying power. I see consistent top 2,3,4 finishes and consistent contention in the Big 12. I see a long streak of NCAA trips. I see a multiple Sweet 16s, plus a possible Final 4 run in 17-18, a team I think could be superior to this past year's team if we add Trae Young.

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Old 07-13-2016, 05:01 PM   #39
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

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There's a good chance that this past season was Kruger's golden season here, and it's silly to not recognize that as a strong possibility.
And I say it's silly to try to compare situations that might be very different.

For instance, at any of the schools you named, did Kruger have his highest ranked recruiting classes arriving on campus following his "best" season?

If you don't know the answer (I don't), then you're making unsupported comparisons. If you do know the answer, I'm all ears.
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Old 07-13-2016, 05:25 PM   #40
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And I say it's silly to try to compare situations that might be very different.

For instance, at any of the schools you named, did Kruger have his highest ranked recruiting classes arriving on campus following his "best" season?

If you don't know the answer (I don't), then you're making unsupported comparisons. If you do know the answer, I'm all ears.
Of course the situation is different. It always is. Do you think the situations at KSU, Florida, and UNLV were identical?
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Old 07-13-2016, 06:54 PM   #41
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Of course the situation is different. It always is. Do you think the situations at KSU, Florida, and UNLV were identical?
No, I don't imagine they were, so I wouldn't rush to claim there's even a "strong possibility" of decline in the program based on what went on elsewhere. There are always too many variables to make such prognostications.

Three straight days of rain could be called a pattern, too, but there's a strong possibility the fourth day will be sunny.
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Old 07-13-2016, 08:38 PM   #42
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

Some of the people in this thread must do great at the racetrack and the stock market since the can foretell the future so well.
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:13 PM   #43
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No, I don't imagine they were, so I wouldn't rush to claim there's even a "strong possibility" of decline in the program based on what went on elsewhere. There are always too many variables to make such prognostications.
I shouldn't utilize data and common trends from a coach's previous 4 jobs to predict the success and trends of his 5th coaching job? Interesting.

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Three straight days of rain could be called a pattern, too, but there's a strong possibility the fourth day will be sunny.
Lon hasn't been coaching three days; he's been coaching 30 years. If it has rained more days than not for the last 30 years, I'm going to bet there's a better chance than not it rains the next day.
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:23 PM   #44
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Do I expect a final four this year?

Hell yeah I DO
If not
FAAAR STOOPS
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Old 07-13-2016, 09:38 PM   #45
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I shouldn't utilize data and common trends from a coach's previous 4 jobs to predict the success and trends of his 5th coaching job? Interesting.
Not if you don't have all the data specific to each situation (and it's a reasonably safe assumption that you don't -- I doubt anyone on this board does).

And you only discussed three of his last four college jobs, omitting Illinois, and left his time with the Hawks out altogether. And three of those four college jobs weren't even in this century.

The only reasonably fair comparison would be between his tenures at UNLV and OU, and his results at those two schools already vary greatly. Kruger's Sooner teams have gotten better every year since he arrived in Norman, which didn't happen at UNLV, and while that trend is unlikely to continue this season, I'd say there's an excellent chance that his first five-year cycle at OU will be equaled or bettered over the next five seasons. I'll see you here in 2021 and we'll see who was right.
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Old 07-13-2016, 10:53 PM   #46
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Not if you don't have all the data specific to each situation (and it's a reasonably safe assumption that you don't -- I doubt anyone on this board does).
It seems as if you're asking me to only comment when a perfectly controlled experiment has been conducted, and when every possible piece of data has been collected. That's simply not how the world works, and certainly not message boards.
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Old 07-13-2016, 10:56 PM   #47
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

Like I said before, Lon's ceiling is higher than its ever been. He was very successful at kstate, Florida, Illinois, and unlv but those jobs are a joke compared to Ou today. The coaches who followed him had some of their best seasons of their careers with Lon's recruits, Bill self being one of them. If he decides to stick around for another 5-7 years Ou will be have a few more final fours and possibly a natty IMO.
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Old 07-14-2016, 02:04 PM   #48
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Seems more likely than not that OU won't be in the Final Four again under Kruger. It's really hard to do. Lots of things have to go right for it to happen.

So yes, it seems likely that OU has peaked under Kruger. Not that we can't get back again or that we won't continue to have lots of success. But chances are that was the best season we'll ever have under Kruger.
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Old 07-14-2016, 02:49 PM   #49
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Default Re: Has OU peaked under Kruger?

If we get trae young and a big guy develops.. i think we'll be back sooner than later
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Old 07-14-2016, 03:01 PM   #50
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Seems more likely than not that OU won't be in the Final Four again under Kruger. It's really hard to do. Lots of things have to go right for it to happen.

So yes, it seems likely that OU has peaked under Kruger. Not that we can't get back again or that we won't continue to have lots of success. But chances are that was the best season we'll ever have under Kruger.
That assumes that the only standard by which a team is judged is tourney success.

If the 2018 squad wins 30 games, takes the Big 12 crown, wins the Big 12 tourney and loses on a buzzer beater in the Elite Eight, would 2016 still be considered Kruger's peak? Not in my eyes, it wouldn't.

It boggles my mind that anyone would assume Coach Kruger won't ever match the success of the 2016 season. Could it happen that he won't? Sure. Is it any sort of given? Hardly.

I guess it takes all kinds, as they say.
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