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Old 03-14-2019, 06:03 PM   #26
Soonerinkc
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Being at the game last time...watching off ball (no tv showing this) manek is NOT a 4...he got manhandled every time down on def...pre position posting.

He's a "3" if anything.
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:09 PM   #27
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Being at the game last time...watching off ball (no tv showing this) manek is NOT a 4...he got manhandled every time down on def...pre position posting.

He's a "3" if anything.
The same thing showed on TV as well. He rebounded pretty well in the OOC, but since conference play he has rebounded poorly.
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Old 03-14-2019, 06:30 PM   #28
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Ok wichita....what's your prediction in the b12 alone? Hell...not even record...top 3, middle 3 bottom 4?

Considering what other teams have coming back (as of now, since it is now we are talking)..

Im going with bottom 4 again.
I think it's a fool's errand trying to predict that at this stage. We don't know who is turning pro, transferring, getting injured, suspended, etc. I think it's safe to say the standings this season look different if Doke, De Sousa, Garret, and Vick all play 30+ games. Same goes for several teams in the conference. Plus it's almost certain that most teams will add recruits in the next couple months. I'm not ducking the question, I'll absolutely be willing to give an educated guess before next season. I'm willing to say right now that barring something unexpected with the roster, we will be better in the backcourt. Like a lot of you, I'm worried about the lack of an effective, true big. But I imagine that will be an area we try to address on the transfer market.
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:26 PM   #29
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I think it's a fool's errand trying to predict that at this stage. We don't know who is turning pro, transferring, getting injured, suspended, etc. I think it's safe to say the standings this season look different if Doke, De Sousa, Garret, and Vick all play 30+ games. Same goes for several teams in the conference. Plus it's almost certain that most teams will add recruits in the next couple months. I'm not ducking the question, I'll absolutely be willing to give an educated guess before next season. I'm willing to say right now that barring something unexpected with the roster, we will be better in the backcourt. Like a lot of you, I'm worried about the lack of an effective, true big. But I imagine that will be an area we try to address on the transfer market.
Understand...

I just see wv with 3 fr and their best big not playing beat tt...ku has 3 fr on the floor most of the time..

Isu young,...

Ksu loses their 3 best guys.

Like you said we have no true big...we've gotten killed lately on the boards
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:30 PM   #30
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The same thing showed on TV as well. He rebounded pretty well in the OOC, but since conference play he has rebounded poorly.
Ah...ok..I was thinking if they followed the ball...most folks watch ball...not the fighting for position underneath...manek just got pushed all the wsy down under the bucket most everytime. Same with freeman.
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Old 03-14-2019, 08:32 PM   #31
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Understand...

I just see wv with 3 fr and their best big not playing beat tt...ku has 3 fr on the floor most of the time..

Isu young,...

Ksu loses their 3 best guys.

Like you said we have no true big...we've gotten killed lately on the boards
Help is on the way:

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=u4QODhJbhd8I
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:21 PM   #32
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I don't understand how you don't think we will be better. Are we really losing much contribution? James plays a lot, but I don't think he's a game changer. I think we can agree Calixte, Reynolds, and McNeace have been disappointments.

I guess if you are down on Harmon, Reeves, Kuath, Hill and the rest then you could make that argument. I just have a hard time believing that group won't be an improvement on what we are losing
Harmon, Reaves, and Williams should all make us better but I expect all 3 to struggle most of the season. It's hard for new guys to come in and make a big contribution as they always seem to hit a wall at some point.

I'm afraid Kuath is along the same lines of every other big Lon has signed. Athletic but soft and unable to play defense or rebound as well as struggling to score. As others have said, Manek and Doolittle at the 4/5 for long periods of time will be a disaster.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:33 PM   #33
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It's funny how OU is losing a 14.5 ppg, 6.5 rpg, and 2apg senior guard and everyone acts like its nothing.

OU is essentially losing about 42 ppg. They average 71 ppg. That means they are losing 60% of the scoring from this years team. Of course, that means more shots for Doo and Manek, and new faces will be there... but there will be pains probably from losing 60% of your scoring.

The key thing is that the talent improves... Calixte and Reynolds both average 7ppg, so on the surface it looks like you are losing two very capable, solid players. But there is always context to these things, and its clear to me that the talent of Reaves and Harmon is drastically superior to Calixte and Reynolds.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:34 PM   #34
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I think we can agree Calixte, Reynolds, and McNeace have been disappointments.
I don't know how Calixte and Reynolds can be considered disappointments when they were widely dismissed on this board before they ever arrived in Norman.

As for McNeace, I'm disappointed that he suffered an injury that ruined his senior season.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:38 PM   #35
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Harmon, Reaves, and Williams should all make us better but I expect all 3 to struggle most of the season. It's hard for new guys to come in and make a big contribution as they always seem to hit a wall at some point.

I'm afraid Kuath is along the same lines of every other big Lon has signed. Athletic but soft and unable to play defense or rebound as well as struggling to score. As others have said, Manek and Doolittle at the 4/5 for long periods of time will be a disaster.
There is no reason to think that Reaves will hit a wall in his third season of college basketball. He has played approximately 70 college basketball games, and it's not like he played for some low level D-1 program (like Calixte and Reynolds). I realize not all of you have personally seen him play, but he isn't an unknown quantity. If a kid transferred to OU after playing two years at, say, Iowa State or Purdue, I don't think nearly as many people would act as if there was a big question regarding how good he can be for us. Bear in mind, I despise WSU, so I would not hesitate to question the kid if I didn't think highly of him.
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Old 03-15-2019, 01:50 PM   #36
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Lets take a look at the game log on Reaves... High majors, ranked teams, or the NCAA Tournament.

6'5'' 180.. Averaged 8 points and 3 rebounds per game at WSU.

10 points against Marquette.... 0-1
2 points against Notre Dame..... 0.1
5 points against Baylor.... 1-1
5 points against Oklahoma State.... 1-2
5 points against Oklahoma... 2-5
5 points against Houston.... 1-2
10 points against Houston.... 0-0
2 points against Houston... 0-1
0 points against Cincy... 0-5
12 points against Cincy... 2-5
0 points against Marshall... 0-3

5.0 ppg and 26% 3pt shooting against high majors, ranked opponents, or in the NCAA Tournament in his sophomore year at Wichita State.

He really made his season in that sophomore year starting Tulsa on January 28th... In a 3 game stretch against Tulsa, Temple, and Memphis he scored 23, 20, and 22.... He finished pretty strong after that as well with games of 11, 12, 10, 11, and 13.

Does this information help anyone with expectation? Or do we still expect him to be a Big 12 level starter right away? Most of us have him automatically penciled in.

Knowing what I just found out about... I think its best if Alondes Williams turns out to be legit and Reaves is 6th man off the bench. That would make OU a better team obviously.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:03 PM   #37
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Lets take a look at the game log on Reaves... High majors, ranked teams, or the NCAA Tournament.

6'5'' 180.. Averaged 8 points and 3 rebounds per game at WSU.

10 points against Marquette.... 0-1
2 points against Notre Dame..... 0.1
5 points against Baylor.... 1-1
5 points against Oklahoma State.... 1-2
5 points against Oklahoma... 2-5
5 points against Houston.... 1-2
10 points against Houston.... 0-0
2 points against Houston... 0-1
0 points against Cincy... 0-5
12 points against Cincy... 2-5
0 points against Marshall... 0-3

5.0 ppg and 26% 3pt shooting against high majors, ranked opponents, or in the NCAA Tournament in his sophomore year at Wichita State.

He really made his season in that sophomore year starting Tulsa on January 28th... In a 3 game stretch against Tulsa, Temple, and Memphis he scored 23, 20, and 22.... He finished pretty strong after that as well with games of 11, 12, 10, 11, and 13.

Does this information help anyone with expectation? Or do we still expect him to be a Big 12 level starter right away? Most of us have him automatically penciled in.

Knowing what I just found out about... I think its best if Alondes Williams turns out to be legit and Reaves is 6th man off the bench. That would make OU a better team obviously.
I'll be happy to make a friendly wager with you on this one. If he doesn't start next year, I will be stunned. If we have three better guards, obviously that would speak well for the talent level on our team, but it also would mean that he isn't playing nearly as well as he is capable. Keep in mind, he had to fight for minutes at WSU as a freshman and sophomore behind a future NBA guard, plus several good, established upperclassman. Plus, Marshall doesn't give any of his players much freedom offensively.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:08 PM   #38
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I don't know how Calixte and Reynolds can be considered disappointments when they were widely dismissed on this board before they ever arrived in Norman.
Not so sure about that. Expectations for Calixte were higher. Reynolds' expectations were lower than his OOC performance, but higher than his conference performance.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:19 PM   #39
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Not so sure about that. Expectations for Calixte were higher. Reynolds' expectations were lower than his OOC performance, but higher than his conference performance.
You remember it very differently than I do. Perhaps the naysayers were just louder, but I recall many more doom-and-gloom posts about them than positive ones. In fact, I don't really recall any particularly positive posts about either player. Let's-wait-and-see posts, yes (mostly in response to all the negative posts), but outright optimistic posts projecting either player to be a big boost to OU's prospects? There were very few (if any) of those.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:33 PM   #40
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You remember it very differently than I do. Perhaps the naysayers were just louder, but I recall many more doom-and-gloom posts about them than positive ones. In fact, I don't really recall any particularly positive posts about either player. Let's-wait-and-see posts, yes (mostly in response to all the negative posts), but outright optimistic posts projecting either player to be a big boost to OU's prospects? There were very few (if any) of those.
Read a LOT of "I trust Lon" posts.
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Old 03-15-2019, 02:46 PM   #41
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Read a LOT of "I trust Lon" posts.
WTSooner... any thoughts on the numbers I posted for Reaves above?
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:18 PM   #42
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Read a LOT of "I trust Lon" posts.
That's about neutral as one can get, if you're not prepared to predict failure for an incoming player -- it's basically one notch above "Let's wait and see." And it's about all one can say to another poster who is rushing to dismiss a player before he's even arrived in Norman (as some were doing).

None of us had seen these guys play much, if at all (including those who were denigrating them). Until we saw what they brought to the table, all we could do was trust Coach Kruger.

And I'll go out on a limb to say, given the situation the team was in, with the departures of Trae and McGusty, we were better off having those guys on the team than playing without them. Reynolds got our hopes up with his non-conference play, but we wouldn't even be in consideration for the tourney without his contributions and the same goes for Calixte.

They both have weaknesses in their games and consistency is an issue, but we were better with them than without them (assuming we didn't turn our backs on some stellar transfers in favor of them, and I'm not aware of that being the case). They were good teammates, from all reports, and comported themselves well and each of them contributed to some key wins.
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:51 PM   #43
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You remember it very differently than I do. Perhaps the naysayers were just louder, but I recall many more doom-and-gloom posts about them than positive ones. In fact, I don't really recall any particularly positive posts about either player. Let's-wait-and-see posts, yes (mostly in response to all the negative posts), but outright optimistic posts projecting either player to be a big boost to OU's prospects? There were very few (if any) of those.
http://ouhoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41991

http://ouhoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41986

http://ouhoops.com/forum/showthread.php?t=41990
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Old 03-15-2019, 03:52 PM   #44
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WTSooner... any thoughts on the numbers I posted for Reaves above?
A little scary. I'll be honest, I don't know a ton about the kid, but I would have thought he had better numbers based on some of the comments I've read here.

Feels like he is going to start, but he may not be the sniper on the wing I was expecting. I think OU really needs either he or Williams to be pretty darn good if this team is going to take a step forward next year. Having both be that good would be even better.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:03 PM   #45
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I would love to model what Villanova does....they basically play 4 guards (2 ballhandlers and 2 wings) and one hybrid post-guy....at least that has been their formula over the last several years. But the caveat is, at all times, they have at least 3 guys on the floor (usually 4 guys) that can shoot the 3 AND break you down off the dribble. It takes very specific recruiting to build your team this way. And with the size and physicality in the Big 12, I don't know if that particular model would work that well (rebounding could continue to be an issue)....unless you recruited at least one elite player per recruiting period. Just my $0.02.
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Old 03-15-2019, 05:17 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by thebigabd View Post
Lets take a look at the game log on Reaves... High majors, ranked teams, or the NCAA Tournament.

6'5'' 180.. Averaged 8 points and 3 rebounds per game at WSU.

10 points against Marquette.... 0-1
2 points against Notre Dame..... 0.1
5 points against Baylor.... 1-1
5 points against Oklahoma State.... 1-2
5 points against Oklahoma... 2-5
5 points against Houston.... 1-2
10 points against Houston.... 0-0
2 points against Houston... 0-1
0 points against Cincy... 0-5
12 points against Cincy... 2-5
0 points against Marshall... 0-3

5.0 ppg and 26% 3pt shooting against high majors, ranked opponents, or in the NCAA Tournament in his sophomore year at Wichita State.

He really made his season in that sophomore year starting Tulsa on January 28th... In a 3 game stretch against Tulsa, Temple, and Memphis he scored 23, 20, and 22.... He finished pretty strong after that as well with games of 11, 12, 10, 11, and 13.

Does this information help anyone with expectation? Or do we still expect him to be a Big 12 level starter right away? Most of us have him automatically penciled in.

Knowing what I just found out about... I think its best if Alondes Williams turns out to be legit and Reaves is 6th man off the bench. That would make OU a better team obviously.
The key for me is how he finished his sophomore season. I think you could pick about any four years player you want and find that their best seasons were when they were juniors and seniors.

I have been high on Austin Reaves for three reasons. One, he’s a deadly shooter from three point range. Assuming his bio on Soonersports is accurate, he made 45% of the shots he took his last season at WSU and 42% the previous season. The shot sample was not limited either.

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BIO
2018-19 (JUNIOR): Will sit out from competition as a redshirt after transferring from Wichita State...Comes to Oklahoma with career averages of 6.1 points, 2.5 rebounds and 1.6 assists...Shot 82-of-182 (.451) from 3-point range while with the Shockers.

2017-18 (SOPHOMORE): In 33 games (11 starts) at Wichita State, averaged 8.1 points, 3.1 rebounds and 2.0 assists in 21.5 minutes…Shot 54-of-127 (.425) from 3-point range…During conference play averaged 9.4 points, 2.9 rebounds and 2.5 assists in 23.6 minutes…Led the American Athletic Conference in 3-point shooting.
Reason #2: Two sources I trust who have seen him play in practice tell me Austin is the best player on the team this season. I believe them.

Reason #3: He made seven three pointers in one half in a game the season before he left WSU. I don’t care who the Shockers were playing. The distance behind the arc is the same for every game.

Time will tell if he will start next season. He should have the advantage of being part of the team in practice this season. But, if he has to battle his way onto the starting lineup, I see that as a good thing.
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Old 03-15-2019, 06:37 PM   #47
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I would love to model what Villanova does....they basically play 4 guards (2 ballhandlers and 2 wings) and one hybrid post-guy....at least that has been their formula over the last several years. But the caveat is, at all times, they have at least 3 guys on the floor (usually 4 guys) that can shoot the 3 AND break you down off the dribble. It takes very specific recruiting to build your team this way. And with the size and physicality in the Big 12, I don't know if that particular model would work that well (rebounding could continue to be an issue)....unless you recruited at least one elite player per recruiting period. Just my $0.02.
I'd love to see that as well. Unfortunately, we'll be scouring the JUCO ranks looking for the next 6-11, 195 lb. project we hope to turn into an elite "rim-protector".

I'm so sick of that crap. If I never hear the word "JUCO" again I'll be thrilled.
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Old 03-15-2019, 07:10 PM   #48
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I don't know how Calixte and Reynolds can be considered disappointments when they were widely dismissed on this board before they ever arrived in Norman.

As for McNeace, I'm disappointed that he suffered an injury that ruined his senior season.
I just remember people saying they’d be scoring 30 points a game combined. I’d consider them disappointments based off of their contribution during conference season
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Old 03-15-2019, 10:11 PM   #49
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I'd love to see that as well. Unfortunately, we'll be scouring the JUCO ranks looking for the next 6-11, 195 lb. project we hope to turn into an elite "rim-protector".
Don't forget the part about being a complete stiff. At least McNiche had the athleticism to do it, but some of these guys...
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Old 03-16-2019, 05:54 AM   #50
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I'd love to see that as well. Unfortunately, we'll be scouring the JUCO ranks looking for the next 6-11, 195 lb. project we hope to turn into an elite "rim-protector".

I'm so sick of that crap. If I never hear the word "JUCO" again I'll be thrilled.
So you never want me to post again?
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