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Old 01-10-2019, 07:50 AM   #26
TulsaWorld
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Our short recap...

Quote:
AUSTIN — Oklahoma pulled within two points in the fourth quarter but couldn’t upset No. 11 Texas, falling 73-63 on Wednesday. Madi Williams led OU with 18 points.

OU (5-9, 1-1 Big 12), which led 20-16 after one quarter but trailed 41-34 at halftime, was battered on the backboards 46-30. Still, Taylor Robertson’s layup with 7:46 remaining capped a 12-2 run that trimmed OU’s deficit to 61-59, but Sug Sutton answered with a three-point play as Texas scored 12 of the final 16 points. The Sooners missed 10 of their last 12 shots.

The Longhorns didn’t help themselves at the free-throw line, making only 13-of-24.

Robertson scored 13 for OU and Mandy Simpson added 10.
As long as I'm here, our other in-state D-1 teams all played yesterday, so there's also brief recaps of OSU's loss to WVU; Tulsa's win vs Memphis; and ORU's win at Purdue Fort Wayne (IPFW).

The only likely NCAA tourney teams in the state at this point are in the Big 12, as ORU (Summit League) is 10-7 overall, while TU (AAC) is 8-7.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:52 AM   #27
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Guys/Gals I watched the game last night and have seen most of the games this year and here is my opinion only, I will not bash any of the young ladies, this is just an old man's opinion.

First; we can not nor will not win a lot of games without taller players, Sherri is recruiting players who are 5'9", 5'10" 6'0" and maybe 6'2" while other teams are recruiting young ladies who are 6'2' and taller. Without a tall post player for today's style of play short players and teams are not going to be successful.

Second: SC likes to run a four guard offense which is great if you have a lot of speed, we don't have it this year and therefore her style is not going to win.

Third: I honestly believe that SC will not be at OU next year unless this team shows some big improvements. She needs to revamp her coaching staff, get rid of her friends and family and find coaches who can coach not just sit on the bench and draw a pay check.

Forth: I think the game has passed SC by and it's time for big changes, we haven't had the attendance we use to get for sometime now and OU fans our tired of watching a team and coaching staff that can't get the job done. I believe that the new President will dump her at the end of the year.

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Old 01-10-2019, 11:06 AM   #28
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Talking Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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Originally Posted by sybarite View Post
In many respects, this was similar to the UConn game. We started well and shot pretty well early. Played good defense, rebounded well early.

Both UConn and Texas put a bit more emphasis on defense and rebounding. Texas held us to shot clock violations about five times. Both teams trailed until they began to use the big man approach.

Both teams had some interior size and could rebound until they finally hit a shot. Texas did it earlier than UConn. But, we came back against Texas, and we might well have pulled it off except that we went cold just as we got it back down to two. Neither Texas nor us scored for several possessions.

But, the Texas juniors and seniors stepped up late---same as UConn. Sutton and Williams, a junior and a senior, did all of the late scoring for Texas, just as Collier and Samuelson had for UConn. We had fits with White and Holmes inside, Collier when she came in: senior, junior, freshman.

The Texas announcers were surprised that a bunch of freshmen had stepped up to provide such a challenge---in Austin. They liked our freshmen better than we seem to.
Perhaps they have not seen as much of them as we have.
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Old 01-10-2019, 11:15 AM   #29
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

No question President Gallogly is not politically attached to Sherri like President Boren was but I think Sherri probably still has Joe Castiglione in her corner. He did allow her to promote Colton to a full assistants position without any credentials which to me is him totally supporting Sherri's opinions.

But I do think that Sherri's seat will get hot in Gallogly's eyes if 2019-2020 is like this year. We have already seen that he is quick to pull the trigger and not losing money is high on his agenda. With Sherri's program losing $3 million plus annually and not winning ball games.

I see Gallogly wanting action to fix both with replacing Sherri probably saving close to $500K and increasing attendance another 2,000 making another half million.
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Old 01-10-2019, 12:07 PM   #30
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Trying to be careful to not get into the bashing of players and coaches. Enough of that going on. But I have questions.

We got crushed again inside. Not dissing Simpson because on the surface she had pretty good line; 10 points, 6 rebounds, 2-2 free throws and 5 assists with only 2 turnovers. But the Texas bigs Holmes, White and Collier scored 32 points and 31 rebounds. Madi added 18 points and 6 rebounds but she is also undersized for a power forward.

Why after losing Mulkey we didn't get a solid center through recruiting, transfers or the grad thing the men used with Calixte and Reynolds. Mandy would be a good off the bench high post player. She has a good IQ and a very good passer. We probably have to play zone while she is in but we play some zone anyway. Some say the transfers aren't the answer but tell that to Oregon where transfer Boley hit 8 treys and over 30 points recently, or to Notre Dame with Jessica Shepherd, or Mississippi State with Howard or to South Carolina who had two starting guard transfers on their championship team.

Why 0 points from Pellington when she has been over 20 and over 30 so far this season. Players are supposed to get better from their freshman to their soph years.

Why does Ana continue to get into foul trouble. She is athletic enough to avoid some of those fouls.

Why can possible the best 3 point shooter in college basketball get off only 8 shots from behind the arc and possibly some of them under intense pressure. (Was unable to watch the game.)

Why do we have so little depth that 3 of our players have to be out there for the entire game. Simpson and Robertson are just not athletic enough to put in that kind of time.

Why do we have such effective out of bounds plays but players have a problem getting open in our half court offense. (Always wondered about that one.)

Why are we so hot and cold. When we lose there is usually a big run sometime in the game by our opponent. When we win we usually have a big run of our own.

Even though we have done better lately with turnovers, why do we usually have so many and many of them unforced or due to us trying to force the play.

Why do we miss so many layups. Women will miss more than the men becuse simply they are further away from the hoop when they release but we miss a ton of fairly wide open layups.

And finally, why have the fans stopped coming. We used to have big crowds and now playing to a nearly empty gym.
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Old 01-10-2019, 12:31 PM   #31
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

A bad and I mean really thing that can happen is...these young ladies will give up and pack it in for the year, how many (if any) will leave after this year? Heck maybe even Sherri & Colton pack it in. Looks like the fans attending games have already done that years ago.
I really can see Sherri stepping down very soon either on her own or by not her own, either way I'm fine with it. Clean house start it over again, see what happens.
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Old 01-10-2019, 02:29 PM   #32
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

I like our freshmen. I see a lot of upside with them. I like our sophomores. I don't like our coaching. Haven't for quite a while. I have no idea why Sherri doesn't produce better teams cause I do think the talent has been there for the girls to be better than they are. I do think Sherri has been put on at least a warm seat cause her recruiting has stepped up. But unless she can get better results from these arguably better recruiting classes I think we will see her replaced. I'm not sure it will be this year, but I would think by the end of next.
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Old 01-10-2019, 03:29 PM   #33
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

I am tired of the arguments that find everything Sherri does as being wrong. Too emotional, too many are from people who haven't really been supporters anyhow.

I would like to see some well thought out discussion of a future without Coale. What do you see happening?

Prior to Sherri accepting a position at OU that I don't think any legitimate assistant wanted at the time, OU was a non-entity. Not every school was going to the NCAA at the time. The tournament has been expanded. But, we had only been once or twice in our history.

In our conference, we had some pretty fair teams. Texas, Texas Tech, Kansas State, and Colorado were national powers. Texas and Tech had won the national title.

We, on the other hand, were a school that had been so supportive that we had cancelled the program. A lot of people don't like that being brought up. But, I see us now as not a lot different from the school that we cancelled a program.

There was no program. It is silly to think OU was headed anywhere, maybe back to cancellation. Despite being "restored," we were still crowdless and talentless.

From this, Sherri built a program that made it to the NCAA tournament 19 years in a row. Show me one other program at OU with that kind of record, especially one that rose from nothing.

Let's look at those other powers. Tech is always in the fight for last place in the conference with no real hope of much improvement. Who wants to go to Lubbock? Is the west Texas recruiting base still viable? They even tried hiring a major coach in Curry. Nichts. Nada.

Kansas State died almost immediately after OU came up. Colorado gave up the ghost quickly. Neither has ever rebuilt to anything resembling a national power. Ceal? Where was your replacement that would rescue the Buffs? KU had actually been a power, temporarily.

The only schools that have been there to challenge OU have been Baylor (probably should have been on probation for the past ten years), Texas (GG withstanding), A&M (never approved of what they called basketball), and Iowa State (never really a challenger for top ten). Some of these have been successful due to questionable tactics. Texas and Iowa State I have no problem with. Texas does have one outstanding recruiting base. If they get half of the best of Texas, they are pretty good. Iowa State does it with a good coach and mirrors. But, they have a great recruiting base, great fan support. Baylor will lie, cheat, rob banks, break laws, and do whatever it takes to win. A&M is somewhat like that. Glad they went to the SEC. Iowa State is more like what I think OU would be like, if we were lucky enough to have a good coach (as we do). No recruiting base, but tremendous crowd support every year, regardless. Always in the top ten. The fact that we have beaten Iowa State more than not is testament to our coach. Bill is good. Nobody else among the Big Twelve coaches could have survived at Ames, except Sherri. They would tolerate Kim.

But, if you aren't in Austin or at a school willing to kill grandma in order to produce a winner, how easy is it to compete? Colorado, Kansas State, Kansas, and Tech just don't get it done any more. They've had a lot of time to try to find a way. Lubbock tried.

What makes you think OU is more attractive than Lubbock or Ames or Lawrence or Boulder? How do you expect the next coach to maintain a program. This isn't like softball or gymnastics where your recruits are from families who had a hundred thousand dollars to put into your preparation. You are recruiting the white suburbs of Chicago and North Dallas.

Do you realize that Sherri has been to one fewer final four than the entire history of the men's program (no male coach has ever taken OU to two final fours)? Oklahoma has produced Blake Griffin, Young, Alvan Adams, Wayman Tisdale, Stacy King, the Prices-----no female prospects of that quality.

The supporters that OU has, like the Stilettos, are a creation of Sherri. She created every marketing tool that we have had. She made it work.

How do you make anything work when she leaves? Are you sure of that? Or, is it just your emotions that make you think that? Show me how your replacement will recruit another Courtney Paris---or even one McDonald's All-American. How will they stir up the fan base? How will they change the OU image?
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Old 01-10-2019, 04:13 PM   #34
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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Originally Posted by sybarite View Post
I am tired of the arguments that find everything Sherri does as being wrong. Too emotional, too many are from people who haven't really been supporters anyhow.

I would like to see some well thought out discussion of a future without Coale. What do you see happening?

Prior to Sherri accepting a position at OU that I don't think any legitimate assistant wanted at the time, OU was a non-entity. Not every school was going to the NCAA at the time. The tournament has been expanded. But, we had only been once or twice in our history.

In our conference, we had some pretty fair teams. Texas, Texas Tech, Kansas State, and Colorado were national powers. Texas and Tech had won the national title.

We, on the other hand, were a school that had been so supportive that we had cancelled the program. A lot of people don't like that being brought up. But, I see us now as not a lot different from the school that we cancelled a program.

There was no program. It is silly to think OU was headed anywhere, maybe back to cancellation. Despite being "restored," we were still crowdless and talentless.

From this, Sherri built a program that made it to the NCAA tournament 19 years in a row. Show me one other program at OU with that kind of record, especially one that rose from nothing.

Let's look at those other powers. Tech is always in the fight for last place in the conference with no real hope of much improvement. Who wants to go to Lubbock? Is the west Texas recruiting base still viable? They even tried hiring a major coach in Curry. Nichts. Nada.

Kansas State died almost immediately after OU came up. Colorado gave up the ghost quickly. Neither has ever rebuilt to anything resembling a national power. Ceal? Where was your replacement that would rescue the Buffs? KU had actually been a power, temporarily.

The only schools that have been there to challenge OU have been Baylor (probably should have been on probation for the past ten years), Texas (GG withstanding), A&M (never approved of what they called basketball), and Iowa State (never really a challenger for top ten). Some of these have been successful due to questionable tactics. Texas and Iowa State I have no problem with. Texas does have one outstanding recruiting base. If they get half of the best of Texas, they are pretty good. Iowa State does it with a good coach and mirrors. But, they have a great recruiting base, great fan support. Baylor will lie, cheat, rob banks, break laws, and do whatever it takes to win. A&M is somewhat like that. Glad they went to the SEC. Iowa State is more like what I think OU would be like, if we were lucky enough to have a good coach (as we do). No recruiting base, but tremendous crowd support every year, regardless. Always in the top ten. The fact that we have beaten Iowa State more than not is testament to our coach. Bill is good. Nobody else among the Big Twelve coaches could have survived at Ames, except Sherri. They would tolerate Kim.

But, if you aren't in Austin or at a school willing to kill grandma in order to produce a winner, how easy is it to compete? Colorado, Kansas State, Kansas, and Tech just don't get it done any more. They've had a lot of time to try to find a way. Lubbock tried.

What makes you think OU is more attractive than Lubbock or Ames or Lawrence or Boulder? How do you expect the next coach to maintain a program. This isn't like softball or gymnastics where your recruits are from families who had a hundred thousand dollars to put into your preparation. You are recruiting the white suburbs of Chicago and North Dallas.

Do you realize that Sherri has been to one fewer final four than the entire history of the men's program (no male coach has ever taken OU to two final fours)? Oklahoma has produced Blake Griffin, Young, Alvan Adams, Wayman Tisdale, Stacy King, the Prices-----no female prospects of that quality.

The supporters that OU has, like the Stilettos, are a creation of Sherri. She created every marketing tool that we have had. She made it work.

How do you make anything work when she leaves? Are you sure of that? Or, is it just your emotions that make you think that? Show me how your replacement will recruit another Courtney Paris---or even one McDonald's All-American. How will they stir up the fan base? How will they change the OU image?
What have you done for me lately? It is past time for her to go and take the baby boy with her.
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Old 01-10-2019, 05:04 PM   #35
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

I agree everyone is entitled to their own opinion, but we owe nothing to Sherri..she been well paid (even over paid imo) Bob Stoops took some heat, why not Sherri and Bob has a NC in his corner. Even the diehards have to admit that the program is stagnant at best. Oh for sure this team will get some better but if you think these type of player that Sherri is recruiting now can compete with the Baylor's of the world..heh
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Old 01-10-2019, 06:32 PM   #36
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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Originally Posted by SoonerSpock View Post
No question President Gallogly is not politically attached to Sherri like President Boren was but I think Sherri probably still has Joe Castiglione in her corner. He did allow her to promote Colton to a full assistants position without any credentials which to me is him totally supporting Sherri's opinions.

But I do think that Sherri's seat will get hot in Gallogly's eyes if 2019-2020 is like this year. We have already seen that he is quick to pull the trigger and not losing money is high on his agenda. With Sherri's program losing $3 million plus annually and not winning ball games.

I see Gallogly wanting action to fix both with replacing Sherri probably saving close to $500K and increasing attendance another 2,000 making another half million.
Gallogly doesn’t give a **** about Sherri Coale or women’s basketball. He will only be here for two or three years max. His wife is still living in Houston, or wherever he came from in Texas and she has no intention of moving here. He may tell Joe C to cut some money from athletic budget but he won’t tell him how to manage a specific sport.
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If you spent half as much time in defending the team you claim to support, posters here might actually believe you're an OU fan. You're all over any mention of ............., but rarely say anything good about the Sooners. Even when you do, you're quick to throw in a backhanded positive to dilute its impact.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:02 PM   #37
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Like it or not, most coaches aren't fired after one losing season. Capel was given one more year to improve before he was fired. John Blake was given 3 years when a lot of people wanted him gone after 2.

I didn't realize Gallogly's hadn't even moved here from Texas. That makes it seem like he's just a hired gun, brought in to lay people off.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:08 PM   #38
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Sometimes I seriously wonder if we had held onto what would have been our junior class this year, how many more games would we have one? I've watched Dungee play a couple of times now and I think undoubtedly she would have been our most consistent leader and valuable player. I wonder if Mulkey would have really contributed as she's so delicate? I say if they had stayed we would be 7 - 7, maybe 8-6 at this point.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:13 PM   #39
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

So, Sherri brought the program back from the dead and she gets to stay here until the end time, even if the program is once again on the slide? Lots of coaches resurrect programs all over and get the boot when they can't maintain it. I've been a season ticket holder for almost 30 years, so yes I do get to criticize. I'm not a coach, I don't know all the Xs and Os and how to fix it, all I can do is look at the bottom line. And the bottom line is this program is stagnant and has been for several years. If Sherri fixes the problem, then Sherri will stay. I have no problem with that. But how long do we continue with what can only be called mediocrity. Attendance is falling off every year. People I sat by for years, who had given up on the men and turned to the women's game are gone. Top to bottom, this is a bad conference and we still struggle.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:15 PM   #40
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Syb, I did not bash Sherri or her coaches in my post. Which of my questions do you feel is unfair and not being asked by a lot of folks.

This was due to be an ugly season with no strong size and so many sophs and frosh.

The internet is a great thing in many respects. One of the downsides is that the bully now uses the internet rather than the school yard to hurt people. I sincerely try to avoid the practice but I do have questions based on what I see on the court.
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Old 01-10-2019, 07:29 PM   #41
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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Originally Posted by MsProudSooner View Post
Like it or not, most coaches aren't fired after one losing season. Capel was given one more year to improve before he was fired. John Blake was given 3 years when a lot of people wanted him gone after 2.

I didn't realize Gallogly's hadn't even moved here from Texas. That makes it seem like he's just a hired gun, brought in to lay people off.
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If you spent half as much time in defending the team you claim to support, posters here might actually believe you're an OU fan. You're all over any mention of ............., but rarely say anything good about the Sooners. Even when you do, you're quick to throw in a backhanded positive to dilute its impact.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:14 PM   #42
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Syb, I did not bash Sherri or her coaches in my post. Which of my questions do you feel is unfair and not being asked by a lot of folks.

This was due to be an ugly season with no strong size and so many sophs and frosh.

The internet is a great thing in many respects. One of the downsides is that the bully now uses the internet rather than the school yard to hurt people. I sincerely try to avoid the practice but I do have questions based on what I see on the court.
Did I make reference to you?

I am referring to a thousand posts which offer no idea of what OU might be like without Sherri, as though we would suddenly be sensational with a different coach.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:33 PM   #43
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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Did I make reference to you?

I am referring to a thousand posts which offer no idea of what OU might be like without Sherri, as though we would suddenly be sensational with a different coach.
Keep in mind Syb that most of those people you were referring to are fans of other teams just trolling on this board.

And SNC is certainly not one of those trolling fans. I also never thought about his posts when I read your fairly well thought out post.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:44 PM   #44
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

I am actually asking for ideas. I see constant complaints, have seen them for several years. We still have people show up and claim that the program went downhill when we lost Bo Overton, as though women couldn't coach.

I want to see a complete program with reasons for its success. I want to know how you replace the fact that there has never been a real program at OU that wasn't totally dependent on Sherri for everything. You have to replace her fan base, marketing ability. You're going to have to show some reason for recruits to come to OU, especially if you don't have a Hall of Fame Coach.

Think and address all of the aspects.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:51 PM   #45
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

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I am actually asking for ideas. I see constant complaints, have seen them for several years. We still have people show up and claim that the program went downhill when we lost Bo Overton, as though women couldn't coach.

I want to see a complete program with reasons for its success. I want to know how you replace the fact that there has never been a real program at OU that wasn't totally dependent on Sherri for everything. You have to replace her fan base, marketing ability. You're going to have to show some reason for recruits to come to OU, especially if you don't have a Hall of Fame Coach.

Think and address all of the aspects.
I agree on most of this.

I also want a female coaching staff. For some reason SC may not agree with that. She virtually refuses to schedule games under her control against teams with female coaches. I have often wondered why. What is you opinion about that?
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:53 PM   #46
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

We play a lot of games against teams with female coaches. It is surprising how many teams have male coaches.
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Old 01-10-2019, 08:53 PM   #47
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

My problem with the OU wbb at present is two "problems" that I see.
1) In recent years past, we often seemed to play below our capabilities. This happens to all teams at times, but we had several years in a row thru last year, when we seemed not to play intelligent basketball, and often seemed not to be playing with "gusto", allowing teams with less perceived talent to win against us. Sometimes that is players, sometimes it is coaching, sometimes both. Whatever the cause, this years team seems to have more fight and hustle, but not the experience to overcome lack of size.
2) Lack of size-Mandy Simpson is smart and plays really hard, but is not big enough or athletic enough to outdo ladies 4 and 5 inches taller than her. Our older players don't contribute. Our forwards are not enough to overcome our overall lack of size, and teams have really hurt us with rebounding, and our fouls while trying to rebound against bigger players. This is totally a failure of the coaching staff in recruiting/evaluating players that should be juniors and seniors now. It is a failure of the Coaching staff to not have found transfers this recruiting cycle, or JC players, or some body of size to play center. You cannot be good if you don't have the ability to rebound, and protect the inside putbacks. Our young players play hard, show promise, and have ability, but lack the ability to break even inside.

Those two things are killers to having a consistent team, and a truly competitive team, and that can only be blamed on the coaching staff. Have the wbb coaches had a serious discussion with the AD, understand their failures, and have a plan to correct past problems? if so, we go forward as is, and evaluate success of that plan. If not, changes should take place.

And yes Sherri Coale is a Hall of Fame coach, a great person, and had OU close to the top of wbb once. But we are not close to where we should be in players, attendance, or wins. Every employee should be held accountable for what they produce.

Last edited by soonermike22; 01-10-2019 at 08:56 PM.
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Old 01-10-2019, 09:03 PM   #48
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Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

So. How would you select a coach to do better, and what would allow her to do better? How would she recruit to Norman? What would make someone want to come play for her?
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Old 01-10-2019, 09:04 PM   #49
Sweetest OU Girl
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Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: Sooner Heaven
Posts: 1,773
Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sybarite View Post
We play a lot of games against teams with female coaches. It is surprising how many teams have male coaches.
In the Big-12 games we do. We have no control about that.

But add them up in the non-conference games over the past 3 years. Other than in a few tournament games (again we have almost no control over the opponent), it is very, very rare.
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Old 01-10-2019, 09:06 PM   #50
soonermike22
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Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 359
Default Re: OU v. TX (Jan 9)

Quote:
Originally Posted by sybarite View Post
I am actually asking for ideas. I see constant complaints, have seen them for several years. We still have people show up and claim that the program went downhill when we lost Bo Overton, as though women couldn't coach.

I want to see a complete program with reasons for its success. I want to know how you replace the fact that there has never been a real program at OU that wasn't totally dependent on Sherri for everything. You have to replace her fan base, marketing ability. You're going to have to show some reason for recruits to come to OU, especially if you don't have a Hall of Fame Coach.

Think and address all of the aspects.
Great coaches are replaced all the time. Often it is a struggle, but eventually we all have to go. We have several ex-players who are coaching, there are many young female (and male) coaches with ability to run a program, and Joe C has proven he has the ability to find them.
The unknown is just that, unknown. But administrators must evaluate, consult, instruct, and decide whether it is time to make a change, insist on new assistants, simply demand a standard of improvement, or set a time limit on time for ongoing changes to take effect.
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