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Old 05-14-2019, 10:57 PM   #51
jmizzy4ou
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Default Re: Magic Johnson as a General Manager

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Great night for LA. Got #4, NY fell to 3, and Boston didn't get Memphis' pick this year.
Yep, options got better. Speaking of Boston, Rozier said he wants out. The locker room is a dumpster fire, and word is Kyrie and Hayward being crybabies is the cause. Their young players have many of the same issues the young Lakers have.

I agree about Ingram. He was playing his best NBA ball ever just before the injury, carrying the offense while LBJ was down. I know people love Kuz, and I like him also, especially for a 2nd round pick, but Ingram's ceiling is much higher. I actually think Playing with LBJ will have a positive impact on Ingram in time. None of the Laker kids have played with anyone resembling a champion, or a leader prior to LBJ coming to town.

The adjustment has been hard for everyone, but I believe LBJ will get the best out of them. Ball is working hard to get healthy, and he actually is slowly cutting his ties to his father's mess. He has already stepped away from the BBB shoe fiasco.

Randle and Rusell were great examples. You woulda thought they were both trash players when they were in LA, based on what the media said about them. Both are now playing at an all-star level. I actually hated when LA couldn't fit Randle in. I liked his game early on. Russell I understood at the time.

I believe things will turn for the best in LA sooner rather than later. Before LBJ went down the Lakers were sitting at 4 in the West. Most have forgotten that. Things cratered as they slumped, but they were probably a playoff team if he didn't get hurt, which was the goal when he arrived. Everyone knew it wouldn't be a one season turn around....
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Old 05-15-2019, 05:53 AM   #52
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Yep, options got better. Speaking of Boston, Rozier said he wants out. The locker room is a dumpster fire, and word is Kyrie and Hayward being crybabies is the cause. Their young players have many of the same issues the young Lakers have.
Please show me one article/report/tweet that says Hayward is a cry baby?

Irving? Sure. Boston fans have hated the way he's been all season. Dude isn't a leader. Isn't an alpha. Doesn't play team ball. That is why MOST Celtics' fans want Ainge to just let him walk (or trade him). Rozier, Brown, Tatum.....all had issues playing with Irving this year. It's no coincidence the team went on a playoff run last year without him.

But Hayward? The only thing I've heard about him is that some of the team didn't like that he was handed a starting spot to begin the season, when he clearly wasn't back to 100%. But that isn't on Hayward, and certainly doesn't make him a cry baby.

There were definitely clubhouse issues this year. That is why I think there is really only two options. You either let Kyrie walk, and build around the rest of the roster, or you keep Kyrie and move a bunch of other guys that weren't happy playing with him. Personally, I don't see Boston winning a championship with Kyrie (probably not even with Kyrie and Davis), so I'd prefer we just move on from him. Probably means taking a small step back next year, but I'm fine with that.
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Old 05-15-2019, 07:02 AM   #53
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Please show me one article/report/tweet that says Hayward is a cry baby?

Irving? Sure. Boston fans have hated the way he's been all season. Dude isn't a leader. Isn't an alpha. Doesn't play team ball. That is why MOST Celtics' fans want Ainge to just let him walk (or trade him). Rozier, Brown, Tatum.....all had issues playing with Irving this year. It's no coincidence the team went on a playoff run last year without him.

But Hayward? The only thing I've heard about him is that some of the team didn't like that he was handed a starting spot to begin the season, when he clearly wasn't back to 100%. But that isn't on Hayward, and certainly doesn't make him a cry baby.

There were definitely clubhouse issues this year. That is why I think there is really only two options. You either let Kyrie walk, and build around the rest of the roster, or you keep Kyrie and move a bunch of other guys that weren't happy playing with him. Personally, I don't see Boston winning a championship with Kyrie (probably not even with Kyrie and Davis), so I'd prefer we just move on from him. Probably means taking a small step back next year, but I'm fine with that.
https://www.businessinsider.com/terr...-season-2019-5

Maybe crybaby wasn't the right word for either player, but it's obvious the young guys weren't connecting with Kyrie or Hayward. I follow numerous NBA reporters on IG, and the consensus is the players don't wanna play with Kyrie. Not 100% an indictment of Hayward or Kyrie, but it sounds similar to what LA dealt with trying to integrate LBJ with a bunch of young players. Boston's young guys know they made it farther last yr without either of those guys, so they felt some resentment towards management for making everything about those 2 players. We all know it can be a coaching or management decision, but the players still develop animosity for each other.

Most Celtic fans enjoyed watching the Lakers struggle this year, and enjoyed the every day reports about LBJ and the young kids not getting along, and the same things were going on in Boston, which is common in most locker rooms today. It's the climate of current professional athletes and the me first, all about me mentality. Kyrie should have remained with LBJ in Cleveland. He's a great talent, but not a leader. From what I've heard about Hayward he is a pretty good guy and teammate. I believe he gave up on Utah to soon....
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Old 05-15-2019, 10:48 AM   #54
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Randle and Rusell were great examples. You woulda thought they were both trash players when they were in LA, based on what the media said about them. Both are now playing at an all-star level. I actually hated when LA couldn't fit Randle in. I liked his game early on. Russell I understood at the time.
Lots of people criticize the Lakers for the Russell trade, but it was an expertly crafted deal. As everybody knows, that cap space cleared led to the Lebron signing, which would warrant moving Russell by itself. The part most people overlook is that Russell is eligible to start making 27M next year. Even had the Deng/Mozgov disaster never happened, I would still take Kuzma at 2M over Russell at 27M, seeing as Kemba and Kyrie can be had for a little bit more in free agency. The deal helped both teams.

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I believe things will turn for the best in LA sooner rather than later. Before LBJ went down the Lakers were sitting at 4 in the West. Most have forgotten that. Things cratered as they slumped, but they were probably a playoff team if he didn't get hurt, which was the goal when he arrived. Everyone knew it wouldn't be a one season turn around....
Exactly. That's why I've been telling people if all the Lakers do is sign Kemba/Butler/Klay and keep the first rounder, they'll be able to compete with anybody except Golden State. And if KD leaves, they might be able to compete with GS, even. The biggest issue is staying healthy. They don't have to sign Kyrie/Kawhi or trade for AD to be one of the better teams in the league.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:00 AM   #55
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Irving? Sure. Boston fans have hated the way he's been all season. Dude isn't a leader. Isn't an alpha. Doesn't play team ball. That is why MOST Celtics' fans want Ainge to just let him walk (or trade him). Rozier, Brown, Tatum.....all had issues playing with Irving this year. It's no coincidence the team went on a playoff run last year without him.
No alpha? The man is an NBA champion. Absolutely torched Steph to get it. Boston didn't live up to expectations, so Boston has thrown him under the bus as a scapegoat. He has played great basketball all year. He's not the issue.

Boston had a nice little run last year in a sorry conference. Eastern conference teams were just fighting for the opportunity to get swept by the Western Conference champs. Boston would have gotten bounced in the first round in the West. The East got a lot stronger this year, and that's the reason Boston didn't go as far. Not Kyrie.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:38 AM   #56
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No alpha? The man is an NBA champion. Absolutely torched Steph to get it. Boston didn't live up to expectations, so Boston has thrown him under the bus as a scapegoat. He has played great basketball all year. He's not the issue.
Sometimes I wonder if we're watching the same games. I must value chemistry a bit more than you. Irving is the me-est of me players. He can torpedo the locker room dynamic like no other.

Hell, he was pissed LeBron was coming back to Cleveland even though they were losing 50+ games every year on his watch. I wouldn't want that guy as dog catcher, let alone my top guard.

Guy's got the best set of handles I've ever seen, though. Maybe he never recovers from that deviated septum.
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Old 05-15-2019, 11:57 AM   #57
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Sometimes I wonder if we're watching the same games. I must value chemistry a bit more than you. Irving is the me-est of me players. He can torpedo the locker room dynamic like no other.

Hell, he was pissed LeBron was coming back to Cleveland even though they were losing 50+ games every year on his watch. I wouldn't want that guy as dog catcher, let alone my top guard.

Guy's got the best set of handles I've ever seen, though. Maybe he never recovers from that deviated septum.
Pretty much how I see it. It "worked" in Cleveland b/c he was playing with one of the all time greats who was in his prime, on a roster tailored to his his style (and Lebron's). East was also weaker during a large portion of that time.

And agree with you on his handles. But in the locker room, in tough games, the dude just isn't a team guy. He was a terrible fit with all that young Boston talent. He held them back. They played better even in the games he missed just this year.

I kind of hope he goes to the Lakers, b/c I don't think he and older Lebron can rekindle what they once had. I don't think they duplicate that in LA.
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Old 05-15-2019, 12:04 PM   #58
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No alpha? The man is an NBA champion. Absolutely torched Steph to get it. Boston didn't live up to expectations, so Boston has thrown him under the bus as a scapegoat. He has played great basketball all year. He's not the issue.

Boston had a nice little run last year in a sorry conference. Eastern conference teams were just fighting for the opportunity to get swept by the Western Conference champs. Boston would have gotten bounced in the first round in the West. The East got a lot stronger this year, and that's the reason Boston didn't go as far. Not Kyrie.
Klay Thompson has a few Championships. Is he capable of winning one while being the alpha (best player), or is he a REALLY good player that has benefited from playing alongside Curry and Durant?

It's not just Boston that has thrown him under the bus. Most NBA personalities (ex-players, media, talking heads) have said the same thing. And for those guys to throw a guy like KI under the bus, that is telling. Doesn't mean he isn't a good player, but dude can kill chemistry like no other.
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Old 05-15-2019, 12:09 PM   #59
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Exactly. That's why I've been telling people if all the Lakers do is sign Kemba/Butler/Klay and keep the first rounder, they'll be able to compete with anybody except Golden State. And if KD leaves, they might be able to compete with GS, even. The biggest issue is staying healthy. They don't have to sign Kyrie/Kawhi or trade for AD to be one of the better teams in the league.
Klay isn't going to LA. That dude is staying in GS, probably even moreso since I expect KD to move on. Butler wouldn't help much. Dude is overrated. Kemba would be solid, but unless you are trading for Davis (thus moving Ball), what is the point?

We'll see what happens. LA has a lot of options, but I'm guessing when the smoke settles, most LA fans will be underwhelmed. I personally link Lebron's game is going to start trending down moreso than others seem to think. I think he'll also start battling injuries the rest of his career. A LOT of miles that on big, heavy body of his. His kids are getting older. He's won a bunch. Motivation could start declining too.

I think Durant is moving on to either the Knicks or the Nets. I think Kyrie either follows him or joins the Lakers. I expect Klay to stay with GS. Doesn't really matter what Butler does. Davis is the guy that I'm not sure about. I think the Knicks can afford to trade for Davis and sign both KD and Irving if I recall.
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Old 05-15-2019, 12:42 PM   #60
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Sometimes I wonder if we're watching the same games. I must value chemistry a bit more than you. Irving is the me-est of me players. He can torpedo the locker room dynamic like no other.

Hell, he was pissed LeBron was coming back to Cleveland even though they were losing 50+ games every year on his watch. I wouldn't want that guy as dog catcher, let alone my top guard.

Guy's got the best set of handles I've ever seen, though. Maybe he never recovers from that deviated septum.
I guarantee that you value chemistry more than me. Chemistry is just that BS term that people use when teams exceed or don't live up to expectations. "Chemistry" is often just a way of saying luck, overlooked/underrated, or good matchup/gameplan. Chemistry exists to some extent, but it's not this easily quantifiable or predictable thing people make it out to be. Steph and Klay have undeniable chemistry, but more importantly, they're two of the best shooters of all-time. That's what really matters.

The Lakers won 3 straight championships with Shaq and Kobe with virtually no chemistry whatsoever. Sure, maybe they'd have won more than 3 with a little bit of chemistry, but an ounce of talent is worth a pound of chemistry. It sounds like the situation in Cleveland was similar.

Speaking of the Lakers, there's not a single accusation being thrown at Kyrie that wasn't being thrown at Kobe. 5-time NBA Champion, Kobe Bryant.
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Old 05-15-2019, 12:50 PM   #61
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It's not just Boston that has thrown him under the bus. Most NBA personalities (ex-players, media, talking heads) have said the same thing. And for those guys to throw a guy like KI under the bus, that is telling. Doesn't mean he isn't a good player, but dude can kill chemistry like no other.
Exactly. It's not a surprise that the media trashed him. Talking heads always look for a scapegoat to blame when teams don't live up to expectations. The surprising part is that his team hasn't stepped up to defend him. Somehow Marcus Smart is the only one with any sense. Boston deserves to lose one of the game's best players.
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Old 05-15-2019, 01:02 PM   #62
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Klay isn't going to LA. That dude is staying in GS, probably even moreso since I expect KD to move on. Butler wouldn't help much. Dude is overrated. Kemba would be solid, but unless you are trading for Davis (thus moving Ball), what is the point?
I've said on here I expect GSW to offer Klay the max (regardless of what KD does), and if they do so, he'll sign on the dotted line immediately. That's not the point I was making. I'm saying that the Lakers can miss on the first wave of free agents (Kawhi, KD, Kyrie) and still be fine with the second wave (Kemba, Butler, Klay). Shoot, they might even be fine getting somebody in the third wave.

As has been mentioned several times, the Lakers were 15-9 to start the year and in 4th place when Lebron went down. Maybe they sustain that, maybe they don't, but it showed that they're a playoff-caliber team when healthy. Yes, Lebron will decline, but Ingram, Ball, and Kuzma will be improving. Simply signing Butler and drafting a guy like Garland would put this team in borderline contention if KD leaves GS. Certainly not the favorites, but not some "pointless" team. If the Lakers are so good that Butler wouldn't help, then you must either think the Lakers are loaded, or just have an absurdly low opinion about him.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:18 PM   #63
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I've said on here I expect GSW to offer Klay the max (regardless of what KD does), and if they do so, he'll sign on the dotted line immediately. That's not the point I was making. I'm saying that the Lakers can miss on the first wave of free agents (Kawhi, KD, Kyrie) and still be fine with the second wave (Kemba, Butler, Klay). Shoot, they might even be fine getting somebody in the third wave.

As has been mentioned several times, the Lakers were 15-9 to start the year and in 4th place when Lebron went down. Maybe they sustain that, maybe they don't, but it showed that they're a playoff-caliber team when healthy. Yes, Lebron will decline, but Ingram, Ball, and Kuzma will be improving. Simply signing Butler and drafting a guy like Garland would put this team in borderline contention if KD leaves GS. Certainly not the favorites, but not some "pointless" team. If the Lakers are so good that Butler wouldn't help, then you must either think the Lakers are loaded, or just have an absurdly low opinion about him.
24 games is a pretty small sample to suggest the Lakers would have been okay. Scheduling differences could have factored into that. The Lakers were 6-9 against playoff teams in there first 25 games.

I'm seem some homer fans, but good grief. You are literally higher on the Lakers' current position than anybody I've heard from recently, and that probably includes their own team and management. Organization has been junk recently, and missed the playoffs this year, and you can't find anything negative to say about them? Odd.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:19 PM   #64
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Exactly. It's not a surprise that the media trashed him. Talking heads always look for a scapegoat to blame when teams don't live up to expectations. The surprising part is that his team hasn't stepped up to defend him. Somehow Marcus Smart is the only one with any sense. Boston deserves to lose one of the game's best players.
Or maybe they are sick of him. Boston has a better record of the past two seasons in games KI didn't play, vs games he did. That is pretty telling.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:24 PM   #65
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The Lakers' won 59% of their first 34 games with Lebron.

That would have put them, winning % wise for the season, almost dead even with the 6/7/8 teams in the West.

They also didn't have a very good winning percentage once he came back. Too many factors to read too much into that, but it's no guarantee they wouldn't have fallen off even had James stayed healthy.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:42 PM   #66
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The Lakers' won 59% of their first 34 games with Lebron.

That would have put them, winning % wise for the season, almost dead even with the 6/7/8 teams in the West.
Cool. So a playoff caliber team, which is exactly what I said. Adding an all-star guard of Butler's caliber and a top 5 pick seems like it would solidify their position.
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Old 05-15-2019, 02:51 PM   #67
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I'm seem some homer fans, but good grief. You are literally higher on the Lakers' current position than anybody I've heard from recently, and that probably includes their own team and management. Organization has been junk recently, and missed the playoffs this year, and you can't find anything negative to say about them? Odd.
You lost your right to call anybody a homer when you claimed Hayward and his disaster of a contract was a valuable trade piece.
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Old 05-17-2019, 11:29 AM   #68
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https://sports.yahoo.com/report-peli...153115371.html

LOL if true. I know, I know, it's easy to say that now but if the Lakers' really do have the best offer, what then? It's also being reported that Boston wants Davis even if Kyrie leaves. To what degree, and even if no promises of an extension? Who knows. But I love that NO doesn't want to trade Davis to LA after the tampering and leaking of trade details.
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Old 05-17-2019, 11:55 AM   #69
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The Pelicans leaked trade details to screw with the Lakers. I don't know why you keep insisting the Lakers leaked information about their entire team being on the block.
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Old 05-17-2019, 01:05 PM   #70
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The Pelicans leaked trade details to screw with the Lakers. I don't know why you keep insisting the Lakers leaked information about their entire team being on the block.
lol, what? Why would NO be upset with the Lakers, and refusing to trade with them? Google it. Every story that comes up pretty much suggests the Lakers leaked it. I'm not making that up.

https://hiphopwired.com/802841/sourc...is-trade-talk/

http://amicohoops.net/pelicans-sourc...s-trade-talks/

https://www.hotnewhiphop.com/pelican...ews.72038.html

I haven't seen much of anything, "scorced", suggesting the Pelicans leaked it. Talk about not making any sense.
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Old 05-17-2019, 02:23 PM   #71
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lol, what? Why would NO be upset with the Lakers, and refusing to trade with them? Google it.
They're upset because AD demanded a trade to LA, and they think LA is the reason he wants out. It's pretty straightforward. While LA likely played a role, the real reason AD wants out is because it's a piss-poor franchise that has wasted nearly a decade of his career. It's easier to find a scapegoat than accept responsibility.

The supposed offer LA made giving up their entire roster/picks/taking back salary was never even made. I have fairly good sources on that, and Buss herself called it fake news. I can't confirm that the Pelicans leaked it -- that's just a guess. It may well have been a fake source not coming from either side. I can only confirm that the Lakers didn't leak a trade that they didn't even offer.

What motivation could the Lakers possibly have to leak that information? If they were leaking information, it would have been that their young core of players were NOT involved in a trade. The Lakers had every reason for privacy, and the Pelicans had none.
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Old 05-20-2019, 06:07 PM   #72
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He will always be one of my few favorites, but I wish at this point Magic would just shut up and move on.....
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Old 05-21-2019, 11:01 AM   #73
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Magic keeps trying to justify himself, but in doing so he just further proves to everybody he was never capable of the job. I thought that Jeannie brought in Pelinka to be the brains and Magic to be the face. I'm still holding out hope that's the case, and the fact that LA hasn't replaced him lends some credibility to that, but I'm worried that Jeannie may have actually brought Magic in for his brain. That's a scary thought.

LA won't have Magic to put the finishing touches on a Kawhi pitch (or Kyrie/whoever else), but the overall IQ of those in the room making major decisions for the Lakers has made a considerable jump

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Old 05-21-2019, 01:32 PM   #74
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Magic keeps trying to justify himself, but in doing so he just further proves to everybody he was never capable of the job. I thought that Jeannie brought in Pelinka to be the brains and Magic to be the face. I'm still holding out hope that's the case, and the fact that LA hasn't replaced him lends some credibility to that, but I'm worried that Jeannie may have actually brought Magic in for his brain. That's a scary thought.

LA won't have Magic to put the finishing touches on a Kawhi pitch (or Kyrie/whoever else), but the overall IQ of those in the room making major decisions for the Lakers has made a considerable jump
I agree.
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