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Old 04-29-2014, 10:01 AM   #1
SoonerNorm
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Default Ranking comparisons

This will be a good year to observe firsthand guru player rankings vs what we see on the court. Below are where the players were ranked coming out of high school or currently still in high school.

Gabbi Ortiz:
3rd best PG. 13th best player in the country.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...abrielle-ortiz

Peyton Little: 8th guard in the country and 30th overall best player.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls.../peyton-little

Maddie Manning:
11th best guard. 34th best player in the country.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...maddie-manning

Gioya Carter: not ranked by ESPN. #158 by Bluestar.

T'ona Edwards: not ranked.

Nicole Kornet: 6th best guard. 20th best player in the country.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls.../nicole-kornet

Kaylon Williams: 16th best PF. 59th best player in the country.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...yer/_/id/72333

Sharane Campbell: 17th best wing. 90th best player in the country.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...arane-campbell

Shaya Kellogg: 26th best PF. Ranked 168th by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls.../shaya-kellogg

Derica Wyatt: 92nd best guard--ESPN Ranked 142 by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...3/derica-wyatt

Felisha Gibbs: not ranked.

Gileysa Penzo:
19th best guard. #262 by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls.../gileysa-penzo

Vionise Pierre-Louis: 15th best post. 96th best overall player. 131st by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...e-pierre-louis

LaNesia Williams: 25th best PG. #274 overall by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...nesia-williams

Chelsea Dungee: 4th best guard. 16th best overall player. 22nd by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...chelsea-dungee

Ana Llanusa: overall 24th best player in the country by Bluestar.

McKenna Treece: 16th best post. #164 overall best player by Bluestar.
http://espn.go.com/high-school/girls...mckenna-treece
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Old 04-29-2014, 12:30 PM   #2
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Default Re: Ranking comparisons

Hope we keep this thread going. It will help all of us in our recruiting discussions over the next year! Thanks, Norm.
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Old 04-29-2014, 04:48 PM   #3
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Default Re: Ranking comparisons

I'm going to pick my starting lineup and see how it jives with the player rankings.

PG- Gabbi (13th best player)
SG- Peyton (30th best player)
SF- Maddie (34th best player)
PF- Kornet (20th best player)
C- Kaylon (59th best player)

That said, it is a bit hard for me to believe Sharane won't be a starter. She very well may start in place of Maddie or Kornet. You need at least one physical player and Sharane is that type of player. Plus, she is also a very good defender. Regardless of which one starts, you will have a quality player to bring off the bench.

Thoughts?
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Old 04-29-2014, 05:58 PM   #4
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There is no way Sharane doesn't start at the four, Norm. And there is no way Kornet will beat her out.

Sorry to disagree with you buddy.


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Old 04-29-2014, 06:00 PM   #5
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Hey Norm, misread your post. I agree with you that Sharane starts and, if she is healthy, I think Maddie beats out Kornet.


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Old 04-29-2014, 06:04 PM   #6
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Quote:
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Hey Norm, misread your post. I agree with you that Sharane starts and, if she is healthy, I think Maddie beats out Kornet.


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You very well could be right that Kornet comes off the bench and, if so, she could bring a scoring punch so that would really good.
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Old 04-29-2014, 08:45 PM   #7
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Default Re: Ranking comparisons

Excellent thread Norm. I just don't see any way that Sharane doesn't start. I think we will have a very solid interchangeable 8 player rotation, with 2 or 3 other's being able to give quality minutes. This off season will separate the girls from the women. Who wants to give every thing for 40 minutes.
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Old 04-29-2014, 09:18 PM   #8
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I'm looking for an eight to nine player rotation. I kind of hope that the rotation falls something like:

Vionese/Kaylon
Sharane/Nicole/Shaya
Gabi/Maddie/Peyton/Gioya

With health issues, I can see McKenna replacing Vionese at first. I think Gioya will find it difficult to hold off Gileysa, and maybe LaNesia.

I think the nine listed above can switch positions a bit with Maddie going inside at times. I put Shaya there because she didn't make as many mistakes as others, and she did hit the boards pretty well at times. I expect her to step up a bit more as a sophomore.
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Old 04-29-2014, 09:32 PM   #9
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One thing I'm hoping to see is for players who make repeated mistakes to have a seat. With this many players there is no reason to allow players to get by with anything.
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Old 04-29-2014, 09:51 PM   #10
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If you examine the UConn roster, they don't have as many McDonald All-American types as Tennessee. But, when you watch UConn, those who make mistakes don't play. He used a six player rotation for much of the year, booming to seven when Kiah began to make strides. They had to be in shape to go almost forty minutes each, and they had to play without errors.
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Old 04-29-2014, 10:46 PM   #11
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Kornet off the bench would be huge! Look at what Notre Dame has done. They had 3 off the bench that were scores as well as other things.
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Old 04-30-2014, 05:40 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sybarite View Post
If you examine the UConn roster, they don't have as many McDonald All-American types as Tennessee. But, when you watch UConn, those who make mistakes don't play. He used a six player rotation for much of the year, booming to seven when Kiah began to make strides. They had to be in shape to go almost forty minutes each, and they had to play without errors.
Tennessee has 6/11 McD AA's
http://www.utsports.com/sports/w-bas...askbl-mtt.html

UCONN has 9/11 McD AA's
http://www.uconnhuskies.com/sports/w...askbl-mtt.html
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Old 04-30-2014, 07:35 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Soonerbay View Post
Actually, it's 6/11 and 8/11 going to 7/13 and 8/13.
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Old 04-30-2014, 08:18 AM   #14
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Default Re: Ranking comparisons

I decided to look them all up for 2010-2013. I don't know where they all ended up. I know that Bria went to Louisville instead of Virginia, and that is included.

10 Duke
9 Connecticut
6 Tennessee
5 Notre Dame, Kentucky, Stanford
4 North Carolina, Maryland, California
3 Texas A&M, Texas, Baylor, Rutgers, USC
2 Florida State, Penn State, LSU, Louisville, UCLA, Northwestern, Syracuse, Washington
1 Alabama, Georgia, Oklahoma, Michigan State, Harvard, Iowa, Dayton, West Virginia, South Carolina, Georgia Tech, Florida, Vanderbilt

Last edited by sybarite; 04-30-2014 at 08:19 AM. Reason: left out Tennessee
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Old 04-30-2014, 08:43 AM   #15
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Let's take a look at the top 4 teams and see which one has the higher ranked players. I am listing the 5 players who started the most games for their team.

UCONN's starters:

Breanna Stewart: Ranked #1 at her position.
Moriah Jefferson: Ranked #1 at her position
Kaleena Mosqueda-Lewis: Ranked #1 at her position
Stefanie Dolson: Ranked #2 at her position.
Bria Hartley: Ranked #4 at her position

TENN. Starters:

Ariel Massengale: Ranked #1 at her position
Cierra Burdick: Ranked #1 at her postion
Bashaara Graves: Ranked #2 at her postion
Meighan Simmons: Ranked #7 at her position
Isabelle Harrison: Ranked #11 at her position

Notre Dame Starters:

Jewell Loyd: Ranked #1 at her position
Kayla McBride: Ranked #4 at her position
Lindsay Allen: Ranked #5 at her position
Ariel Braker: Ranked #23 at her position
Natalie Achonwa: Not ranked as she was from Canada

Stanford Starters:

Chiney Ogwumike: Ranked #1 at her position
Amber Orrange: Ranked #3 at her position
Sara James: Ranked #3 at her position
Mikaela Ruef: Ranked #4 at her position
Lili Thompson: Ranked #62 at her position
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Old 04-30-2014, 08:54 AM   #16
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Throw in Geno as the coach and it's no wonder UCONN went undefeated.
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Old 04-30-2014, 09:38 AM   #17
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OU's projected starters:

PG- Gabbi (3rd best player at her position)
SG- Peyton (8th best player at her position)
SF- Maddie (11th best player at her position)
C- Kaylon (16th best player at her position)
PF- Sharane (17th best player at her position)
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Old 04-30-2014, 09:53 AM   #18
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If we ever want to get back in the top 10, we have to recruit more players ranked in the top 5 at their positions.
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Old 04-30-2014, 10:22 AM   #19
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Default Re: Ranking comparisons

Norm,
but if OU was going to have only one spot being a top five player, I'd rather it be at PG considering the history of performance with Drob and Dionnah Jackson.
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Old 04-30-2014, 10:34 AM   #20
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Norm,
but if OU was going to have only one spot being a top five player, I'd rather it be at PG considering the history of performance with Drob and Dionnah Jackson.
I don't disagree. DRob won us a lot of games and I think Ortiz will do the same. But, she needs help. I know some will blow a gasket when I say this but we just don't have a post player who can help us beat the likes of Baylor. Kaylon is limited and I'm afraid there is a reason the other bigs we have coming in were not highly recruited. We simply have to stop looking for diamonds in the rough and just filling the roster and concentrate on the best players.
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Old 04-30-2014, 12:55 PM   #21
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Norm,
the ceiling on the 2014-15 squad might be determined by the young posts and Kaylon.
Vionese looked great on film prior to the injury.
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Old 04-30-2014, 01:26 PM   #22
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For some reason, I see a lot of difference between Tennessee's #1s and UConn or ND's #1s. I have seen nothing in Massingale or Burdick that compares to Stewart, or even a #4 in McBride for that matter. Duke, which apparently has a lot of McDonald's All-Americans has not impressed me in recent years like ND or UConn. ND was undefeated in the ACC, and Miami won the ACC a couple of years ago without any McDonald's AAs as I remember.

Does the Bobby Burton effect enter the picture here? Are these McDonald's All-Americans before or after they are recruited by these schools? There appears to be a disparity in that UConn's AAs are really good. Geno and Muffet seem to know which ones you can win games with. Or, is it that they are AAs because Duke, ND, and UConn want them?

As I looked through the list of McDonald's All-Americans for the past four years, there are quite a number that I haven't heard of since. Some, like Fortran and the Alabama player transferred somewhere. But, some just don't seem to have lived up to their billing. Of course, not everyone at UConn does either. Where did Walker go?

There is also another factor. A lot of these kids are good. But, ND and UConn seem to have the difference-makers. If you had a team of Hartleys and Dolsons, I think you would be pretty good. But, it is the Stewart. Mosqueda-Lewis, Loyd, and McBride types that take you to the top. Of OU's McDonald's All-Americans, only Courtney was someone who was the type to get you to the top level. Abi, Ashley, Amanda, and Aaryn (all A's?) were nice players, but they weren't going to be that one who got you over the hump.

Curiously, I can see Maddie as that type of player. If Kornet could hit her shots like she did when she was MVP of that all-American game, she might be one. I don't know about Little. I get the feeling that they can be nice players, but only Maddie seems to be one that could get you to the next level. I'm not sure I saw that in Ortiz. I think she will be very good, but I'm not sure she can be THE difference-maker. I wonder about Vionese and Penzo.

I never felt that Duke or Tennessee was much better than we were. We just didn't play well when we played them. This particular team didn't have the DRob type or Jo-type that fought you for the win. We left close games on the table.
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Old 04-30-2014, 01:56 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by atlantasooner View Post
Norm,
the ceiling on the 2014-15 squad might be determined by the young posts and Kaylon.
Vionese looked great on film prior to the injury.
It is very encouraging when I read comments like these from Full Court:

Vionise Pierre-Louis, 6-3 center, Essence Purple (Lake Worth FL)

Pierre-Louis was our Full Court unofficial event MVP. Why? Consistency. Game after game, she did her job (posting up hard on offense, hitting some face-up shots, rebounding, making a few high-low passes and finally defending her opposite number at the other end of the court). To cap these off, she led her team with 18 points in the final win over Central Florida Elite 2014.


I liked the youtube clip we saw of her too but those can be very deceiving. You can take Gibbs and make a vido clip that makes her look like an All-American. Videos are beneficial to show off a person's ability to handle the ball, pass, jumping ability, etc but honestly, the shooting videos are pretty worthless to me. They never show the shots that were missed. If I'm not mistaken, Vionise is coming from a 2-A school which can inflate her stats. I believe Gibbs had similar stats to Vionise when she was in high school.

Believe me, I hope that ViVi is a great center at OU. But, when other coaches from top programs don't show interest, it makes me wonder why. The bottom line, I am cautiously optimistic. Optimistic that she is really good and optimistic that she will be 100% healthy.
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Old 04-30-2014, 02:29 PM   #24
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If there is any validity to their score-keeping, I would love to see Vionese continue her FG% of around 78% in college along with her senior free throw percentage of about 73%. Around five blocks a game might be expected in a small school conference with a 6-4 post, but only four turnovers as a senior?

I'm also curious that she was 8 for 16 from three point range as a junior.

I also see that she won the Florida Player of the Year with some Dairy Farmers Association in a close vote with Mompremier(sp?), the center from MIami.
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Old 04-30-2014, 04:05 PM   #25
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Taking a look at some of the recent Texas recruits.

2013

Nekia Jones: Ranked #7 at her position

2014

Ariel Atkins: Ranked #1 at her position
Brooke McCarty: Ranked #6 at her position

2015

Jordan Hosey: Ranked #3 at her position
Lashann Higgs: Ranked #5 at her position
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