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Old 01-10-2022, 11:28 AM   #1
cowboysooner
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Default My Take on the NIL issue

Courts properly ruled that you can't tell a kid he can't be a pro and also keep him from making money. Universities wanted to make the money off of their efforts and not have to pay anything but a free education for it. In short, they wanted their cake and eat it to. Their power to dictate this was always illegal in America and finally the Courts caught up to it. The law finally won over power and influence.

This being said, there is nothing that prevents the NCAA from dictating what constitutes "being an amateur" and thus allowing participation in NCAA sports. The NCAA can simply outlaw the receipt of any form of money for playing, including NIL money. This would be perfectly legal provided you also don't forbid them from turning pro whenever they want (at birth if they want) nor prevent them from working while on scholarship.

In all sports, particularly in basketball, you will lose some kids to the pro game right out of high school, but so be it. If we don't see them, we won't miss them.

You just can't and shouldn't be able to make a kid work for you for free and not be able to make a living. You can reserve amateur sports for kids that haven't and aren't getting paid for being an athlete, if you want to. You just can't have it both ways.

BTW, it is worse than you think. There is no law anywhere that provides workers compensation benefits to kids that are injured or disabled during NCAA sporting participation. There is no law and never has been any law that requires a University to pay for the medical expenses of a kid injured while playing and/or practicing for a University. Most major universities do pay for such medical (for their own benefit and to avoid a lawsuit and precedential court cases) but many smaller schools just jerk your scholarship and refuse to pay for the medical expenses. I am a lawyer and have had to represent a couple kids on these matters. I was successful by threatening the schools with a potential a workers compensation case.

Look big school football is big business. Last year I believe OU generated $160mil from its football operation. This is direct income. You also get loyalty that leads to donations and endowments etc. The indirect benefit to a big time football program is mind blowing money/business. Why pay the kids for generating this revenue if you don't have to. More profitable not to.

I say lets go strictly amateur. Let the kids go pro if they want, let them get NIL deals if they want, and restrict NCAA participation to those that don't go that route. Then, obligate universities to pay for medical expenses incurred by kids injured "on the job", provide some measure of money for those disabled due to their participation, and allow them to work if they can while attending school. This would be perfectly legal.

I think this is where we are going by the way. Schools had the best of all worlds to now, but with NIL money going from boosters to kids, they will want that changed. Don't think there is any way to change except as mention above. Money will bring about this I believe.

Last edited by cowboysooner; 01-10-2022 at 11:31 AM.
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Old 01-10-2022, 12:20 PM   #2
MsProudSooner
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

How are injuries that happen on the court or on the field handled now?
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Old 01-10-2022, 01:39 PM   #3
cowboysooner
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

MsProud, differently depending upon the school. Most of the big universities want you to use your own medical insurance, if you have it, and if you don't they will process you through their own doctors. It is in their interest to get you back on the court or field. With some of the small schools, depending upon how important you are to their program and how much the medical is going to cost, they will get you the medical treatment or they will just refuse to pay the expense and tell you it is on you to get the treatment.

Most universities have health insurers that will offer policies to kids/students at their expense. I haven't seen it, but I would imagine that some universities perhaps pays for these policies on their athletes.

I had a kid that fell when undercut on a fast break and broke his hip. It was during the last game of the season. The coach was fired (nothing to do with the kid or injury, just didn't win enough). A new coach was hired and he simply called the kid in and said they weren't renewing his scholarship and wouldn't be paying for surgery. They relented when I threatened to file a workers compensation case, and/or sue them for fraud in the inducement (implicitly misrepresenting to him that such injuries would be taken care of by offering him a scholarship and asking him to play). I don't know why they relented, they didn't tell me, but they did offer to pay for the surgery with a doctor and hospital of their choice.

You don't have to be a lawyer, just an American citizen, to understand that telling a kid he can't work (as a professional player or otherwise) once he turns 18 is unconstitutional. Determining what constitutes being an amateur is a completely different issue. You can have amateur sports. They don't have to be intramural. What you can't do, and shouldn't be able to do is tell a kid he has to play a sport for free so that universities and coaches can make a lot of money for a while before working for themselves.

I say just make kids pick amateur sports or pro sports and live with their decision. Most will pick amateur sports. The few that don't, best of luck to them.
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Old 01-10-2022, 05:59 PM   #4
Soonerinkc
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

yup...agree 100%.

Most folks don't know that a scholarship is 4-1 yr deals...or however long. Each yr it is renewed. Kids are "advised" to look elsewhere if the new staff or they don't meet expectations.

Son played D1 Juco baseball...got hurt playing and they they were all over my insurance.
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Old 01-10-2022, 07:48 PM   #5
BoulderSooner
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Soonerinkc View Post
yup...agree 100%.

Most folks don't know that a scholarship is 4-1 yr deals...or however long. Each yr it is renewed. Kids are "advised" to look elsewhere if the new staff or they don't meet expectations.

Son played D1 Juco baseball...got hurt playing and they they were all over my insurance.
almost the entire power 5 including the big 12 went to "4 year" scholarships a while ago ..

so they are no longer 1 year deal ..
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Old 01-10-2022, 08:04 PM   #6
Soonerinkc
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

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Originally Posted by BoulderSooner View Post
almost the entire power 5 including the big 12 went to "4 year" scholarships a while ago ..

so they are no longer 1 year deal ..
AhÖ interesting didnít know that.
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Old 01-12-2022, 12:23 AM   #7
Speedy17
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

An athlete can go pro in baseball or basketball after graduating High School but the NFL has a rule that they can't go pro until they are 3 years removed from HS. This is why football is a big problem for the kids especially with its high physical risk. The NFL is pushing the development and risk to the colleges.

One misnomer that is written in this thread is that the universities are making all of this cash. There are two components that are part of that. The football and in some cases the men's basketball programs the revenue is more than the expenses but not all are making huge profits. Title IX, which I support, is legally forced for gender equity. Unfortunately, most sports do not break even. This means that football, men's basketball, or the university must subsidize the rest of the sports. Only about 10 % of FBS schools are not subsidized by the university in some form or manner. In a lot of cases, schools trying to build athletic programs are being subsidized by student fees. The top offenders in that category is Houston, UCF, and James Madison. Those students are paying over a $1000 in athletic fees per semester to support those programs. College athletics is a complex dilemma. We are fortunate at OU because the athletic department actually gives money back to the university.
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Old 01-12-2022, 08:23 AM   #8
BoulderSooner
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedy17 View Post
An athlete can go pro in baseball or basketball after graduating High School but the NFL has a rule that they can't go pro until they are 3 years removed from HS. This is why football is a big problem for the kids especially with its high physical risk. The NFL is pushing the development and risk to the colleges.

One misnomer that is written in this thread is that the universities are making all of this cash. There are two components that are part of that. The football and in some cases the men's basketball programs the revenue is more than the expenses but not all are making huge profits. Title IX, which I support, is legally forced for gender equity. Unfortunately, most sports do not break even. This means that football, men's basketball, or the university must subsidize the rest of the sports. Only about 10 % of FBS schools are not subsidized by the university in some form or manner. In a lot of cases, schools trying to build athletic programs are being subsidized by student fees. The top offenders in that category is Houston, UCF, and James Madison. Those students are paying over a $1000 in athletic fees per semester to support those programs. College athletics is a complex dilemma. We are fortunate at OU because the athletic department actually gives money back to the university.
basketball for the NBA is one year out of high school ..
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Old 01-12-2022, 09:08 AM   #9
Speedy17
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

You can go to the D-League out of high school. A bunch of guys do it every year. Jonathan Kuminga was the #7 lottery pick last year.
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Old 01-12-2022, 09:52 AM   #10
BCSooners
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

Quote:
Originally Posted by Speedy17 View Post
An athlete can go pro in baseball or basketball after graduating High School but the NFL has a rule that they can't go pro until they are 3 years removed from HS. This is why football is a big problem for the kids especially with its high physical risk. The NFL is pushing the development and risk to the colleges.

One misnomer that is written in this thread is that the universities are making all of this cash. There are two components that are part of that. The football and in some cases the men's basketball programs the revenue is more than the expenses but not all are making huge profits. Title IX, which I support, is legally forced for gender equity. Unfortunately, most sports do not break even. This means that football, men's basketball, or the university must subsidize the rest of the sports. Only about 10 % of FBS schools are not subsidized by the university in some form or manner. In a lot of cases, schools trying to build athletic programs are being subsidized by student fees. The top offenders in that category is Houston, UCF, and James Madison. Those students are paying over a $1000 in athletic fees per semester to support those programs. College athletics is a complex dilemma. We are fortunate at OU because the athletic department actually gives money back to the university.
MLB has minors & NBA has the G-League to let players develop physically, if needed. NFL is by far the toughest physically on a player. A 19 year old will get seriously hurt by a 28 year old in the NFL.
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Old 01-12-2022, 07:26 PM   #11
vbdad
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Default Re: My Take on the NIL issue

Speedy17: "We are fortunate at OU because the athletic department actually gives money back to the university."

This is true but it adds up to exactly the amount of money ($5) that is charged for every football ticket as an academic enhancement fee. So the athletic department gives to the University but it is money from a fee. My four tickets get them $20 every game. It's a small amount compared to overall cost but it's irritating they don't give the fans the tax credit.
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